The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Ascension » Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:42 pm

I remarked on it to a friend of mine after the last episode, but it's even more obvious here... I find it very interesting that our protagonists in IBO are no longer fighting for any kind of higher ideals. They were on the (relatively) morally heroic side as long as they were supporting Kudelia, but that's fallen to the wayside now, with Orga desperately grabbing for comfort/security in the form of pure power, and that quest leading Tekkadan to support a guy, McGillis, who would be the Big Bad in any other Gundam series. They're essentially a power-mad villain's muscle now.

Given the number of episodes left, I won't be surprised at all if they try to course-correct at the end by pitting Tekkadan against a definitely-evil "final boss" (whether McGillis or someone/something else), but still, I can't think of any other Gundam show that went even this far in making its heroes... unheroic.

I like it. It's nicely distinct.
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by dienrachen » Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:04 pm

Amion wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:37 pm
As for the final battles, it looks like we could be in for some confusion on who fights who. Hopefully Julietta will get a rematch with Mika before all is done.
In which universe does she last more than a few seconds against Barbatos, though?

EDIT: I'm really so confused about her character, to be honest. It's like the writers themselves are wondering why they put her in. Initially I felt that she was supposed to be something of a foil to Mika - the aloof, Master's Obedient Dog kind of warrior. But then they go out of their way to liken her to Ein, a non-AV pilot who clearly smashes against her limits and is desperately looking for a way past that barrier.

As everyone but her has AV now, I'd fully expect her to remain weightless in combat. But then why is she around? Is she supposed to be something like a morality-chain for Vidalio? But she's not a character with strong morals either.

I just can't seem to figure it out.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Kuruni » Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:32 pm

I just can't seem to figure it out.
Well, I think it would help if you stop thinking that she must be "[insert name here]'s foil", "[insert name here] Mk-II", or "[insert name here]'s moral chain".
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by yazi88 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:15 pm

Yikes.... this is a very very very F'd up situation... I don't even know who to root for anymore. Rustal may be charismatic but he has committed a lot a atrocities like McGillis's subordinates said and we've seen it. McGillis is the one that may go down the power hungry route everyone thought Orga was going to.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Amion » Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:33 pm

dienrachen wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:04 pm
Amion wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:37 pm
As for the final battles, it looks like we could be in for some confusion on who fights who. Hopefully Julietta will get a rematch with Mika before all is done.
In which universe does she last more than a few seconds against Barbatos, though?

EDIT: I'm really so confused about her character, to be honest. It's like the writers themselves are wondering why they put her in. Initially I felt that she was supposed to be something of a foil to Mika - the aloof, Master's Obedient Dog kind of warrior. But then they go out of their way to liken her to Ein, a non-AV pilot who clearly smashes against her limits and is desperately looking for a way past that barrier.

As everyone but her has AV now, I'd fully expect her to remain weightless in combat. But then why is she around? Is she supposed to be something like a morality-chain for Vidalio? But she's not a character with strong morals either.

I just can't seem to figure it out.
She does pretty well against Mika in their initial battle, from what I recall. In fact, she does pretty well all things considered. Fighting people naturally faster and more "aware" than you is no small feet. Just because she's not killing her rival each time doesn't mean she's incompetent. It's one reason I dislike seeing people deride characters for losing. Well, they're not dead, and this isn't shounen, so they have the skills to survive at least. And she didn't even have a Gundam last time.

But I will be more judgemental if she fails to catch the Barbatos Rex off-guard with her Reganlaze. She's really a lot like Jarid was when he was still a half-way legit threat. But who knows, she could end up more of a Yazan by the end. Though perhaps her smackdown by Amida was the sign of her Jaridation.

But yeah, I do see what you mean. She does sort of feel like a drifting loose end right now. But loose ends have an allotted fate. :twisted:
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by dienrachen » Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:34 pm

Kuruni wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:32 pm
I just can't seem to figure it out.
Well, I think it would help if you stop thinking that she must be "[insert name here]'s foil", "[insert name here] Mk-II", or "[insert name here]'s moral chain".
Okay, but then all I see is a pilot who's supposed to be a prodigy but fails to deliver every time she's on the battlefield.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by yazi88 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:41 pm

Its more like Julietta is completely outmatched by all the other ace pilots with a Gundam and AV systems. She is a good pilot but in the 1st match against Mika, who didn't even bother with her cause of the Dawn Horizon corps, she is no where near a match. Plus while its nice she is asking questions, she is blind to all the atrocities going on in Gjarrhorn because of her undying faith to Rustal, she is perhaps now seeing how morally screwed up Gjharrhorn is and while its very late in the show I appreciate that.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by dienrachen » Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:45 pm

Amion wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:33 pm
dienrachen wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:04 pm
Amion wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:37 pm
As for the final battles, it looks like we could be in for some confusion on who fights who. Hopefully Julietta will get a rematch with Mika before all is done.
In which universe does she last more than a few seconds against Barbatos, though?

EDIT: I'm really so confused about her character, to be honest. It's like the writers themselves are wondering why they put her in. Initially I felt that she was supposed to be something of a foil to Mika - the aloof, Master's Obedient Dog kind of warrior. But then they go out of their way to liken her to Ein, a non-AV pilot who clearly smashes against her limits and is desperately looking for a way past that barrier.

As everyone but her has AV now, I'd fully expect her to remain weightless in combat. But then why is she around? Is she supposed to be something like a morality-chain for Vidalio? But she's not a character with strong morals either.

I just can't seem to figure it out.
She does pretty well against Mika in their initial battle, from what I recall. In fact, she does pretty well all things considered. Fighting people naturally faster and more "aware" than you is no small feet. Just because she's not killing her rival each time doesn't mean she's incompetent. It's one reason I dislike seeing people deride characters for losing. Well, they're not dead, and this isn't shounen, so they have the skills to survive at least. And she didn't even have a Gundam last time.
Surviving to fight another battle is a nice thing, but if you lose every time you'll probably lose the war as well at some point. And I didn't say she's incompetent; she's a lot like Ein really, who was a fairly good pilot of his own. They are simply out of their depth because they're like two normal people in a war full of Supermen. I'd like to highlight this bit:
Fighting people naturally faster and more "aware" than you is no small feat
Virtually everyone who matters and pilots MS has AV at this point, except her. Seriously, the only important pilot without AV I can remember at this is her and Hush.

She's got a terrible handicap.
Amion wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:33 pm
But yeah, I do see what you mean. She does sort of feel like a drifting loose end right now. But loose ends have an allotted fate. :twisted:
To be frank, Rustal's faction will probably have to fall as they're part of the old and corrupt Gjallarhorn. With that in mind - and with Julietta's unhealthy obsession about being Rustal's lapdog - she's probably in for some bad time no matter how good she is. But at this rate her exit scene won't be some glorious last stand but a pitiful smack-around.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by domino » Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:26 pm

I'm glad to see them finally reveal Vidar-Eins. It was so obvious to me. I chuckle when I remember so many doubting it.

It's interesting that Ein only remains as AI so he is effectively "dead". I was half-expecting some crazy psycho-babble from when he was in his previous machine.

Both Gaelio and McGillis have proven that modern AV surgery can be conducted on human subjects. Though I suppose McGillis had a different variation conducted on him since he's only the human controls to the AV brain.

I have to wonder if Tekkadan will really stay on McGillis side to fight out the remainder of this coup

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by yazi88 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:36 pm

I'm not sure if Vidar actually got the AV implant.... it seemed to be cybernetics on his arm to connect to the Ein AV system. Cause he's not controlling the machine.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by AmuroNT1 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:45 pm

The impression I got was that portions of Ein's brain (or maybe copied brainwave data or something like that) are installed in Galieo's pilot suit and THAT'S what Vidar's A-V System is hooking into. Notice how he acts when he activates the system: he takes his hands off the control sticks and says things like "I leave it all to you!"

Also, I'm a little confused about all this talk about Agnika Kaieru's "soul" being with the Bael. (I believe the word used was "tamashii".) A few people, like ANN's reviewer, seem to believe this means Bael has Kaieru's mind in it as with Vidar and Ein, but something tells me it's just metaphorical, and Bael is like Excalibur, a symbol of power and authority that not just anyone can use.

And here's something to ponder: With McGillis revealing an A-V implant this week, people are asking "I thought the surgery couldn't be performed on adults?" My response to that is:

Who ever said that McGillis got the implant when he was an adult?
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by SNT1 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 6:52 pm

HOLY BAD WORD, IT'S ON

+First positives out of the way: No Atra, No Kudelia, no Tekkadan crew, no BS. Just the important characters.

+Not exactly a positive, but funny nonetheless that Iok might actually survive this whole ordeal.

NOW, WHO DA HECK DO YOU ROOT FOR?

+McGillis is pretty much FUBAR thanks to that horrible flashback, and that Bael speech was dead on with what I said earlier; he's pretty much gonna declare to be the second coming of Agnika Kaieru (I called that)

+But let's get on with that fact in detail: A pseudo-AV system! Vidar has it (Ein's brain, as multiple other people have also called it), and apparently Bael has it (Agnika! EDIT - at least that's what it felt like when he refers to Agnika's soul. Unless he's being metaphorical and just got a straight up AV implant) I liked it when Mika engaged Vidar to begin, Vidar was essentially Gaelio, but with EinOS booting up he gets on the same level as Mika, but presumably without the berserker trance that Mika gets into, if I understood Shady McRedhead's explanation. But hell, that was awesome, some effin Trans-Am level ZOINKS when VIdar got into the BLR's back.

+Loved Gaelio's return! When McGillis was doing his "I AM YOUR GOD" speech, Gali Gali flat out comes back unmasked to expose McGillis! Not to mention he looks like a proper badass too, with that battle scar. I'd be disappointed if the final showdown wasn't between Vidar and Bael. I guess I will be, because...

-What the heck is Tekkadan's role in all of this? Mika and Tekkadan are a bit of tools, literally, going forward. Since they really have no plan in all of this as McGillis' chess pieces, they're shockingly irrelevant this late in the season. For what it's worth though, I don't see McGillis turning on Tekkadan, unless Tekkies turn on him first.

+Almiria gonna dead?

+What's heading for the moon?

This is the best episode of S2. It's all coming full circle. I wish it doesn't stop ramping up from this point on. But for now, I...

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by yazi88 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:58 pm

We didn't see McGillis with the implant as a kid... plus it could be a recent implant he did cause he mentioned something about doing his own research from the Graze Ein AV conflict... Plus we didn't see any bulges on his back... it might be a modified implant rather than the traditional one we saw on the Tekkadan kids and the cyborg Ein.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by X_zoro » Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:02 pm

I'm actually shocked that gaelio isn't as Angry with Mika given what happen with season 1 and his relationship with Ein kinda a miss opportunity if you ask me, makes their fight would have so much more meaning :/

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by AmuroNT1 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:10 pm

Yazi: He wouldn't have had any reason to have an implant in the past, not until he learned about Agnika Kaieru as we saw in the flashback. Either that, or I suppose his research found a safer way of installing it.

Gaelio's attitude towards Mika seems pretty pragmatic to me; he realizes that they were enemy combatants and that there was literally nothing personal behind it, plus everything that's happened seems to have made him "grow up" a bit (at least in terms of abandoning his earlier knightly idealism). He hates McGillis because he spent years trying to become McGillis' friend, only to get emotionally back-stabbed (and literally front-stabbed).
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Amion » Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:27 pm

And with his Gundam's own lance, let us not forget.

As for Galileo's reaction to Mika, I am honestly not pleased either that he totally disregarded their past rivalry. They had a funny dynamic going that hopefully will get more focus at some point. Who knows, maybe he will attempt to recruit Mika's help against the Chocolate Char? I doubt it, but it seemed like he was trying to clear the air with him and Mika after finding himself slightly outnumbered. It reminds me of how Haman Khan, Char and Scirocco were all over each other in a tussle to sell out and betray loyalties at the end for their own benefit, only significantly more subtle and honest.

Someone on another forum mentioned the blood on Almiria's hands was her father's. That could be true, and very sad that McGillis decided to get rid of dear old "dad." Can't blame him. His definition of father probably ain't the cleanest word in his dictionary. In fact, I must wonder what Gallus was thinking, selling out his daughter like that to someone so much older. Iznario didn't force him, he could have said no, surely. :?
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by SNT1 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:34 pm

As for Galileo's reaction to Mika, I am honestly not pleased either that he totally disregarded their past rivalry. They had a funny dynamic going that hopefully will get more focus at some point. Who knows, maybe he will attempt to recruit Mika's help against the Chocolate Char?
Eh. I never sensed that Gaelio had any sense of real "rivalry" against Mika; only that they both had Gundams and fought a couple of times. If there was any actual rivalry between the two then it's surely dwarfed by his beef with McGillis. I am not even so sure how high Gaelio puts Tekkadan on his overall concerns/hit list; and if he does then it's only because they're allied to McGillis.
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by X_zoro » Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:14 pm

AmuroNT1 wrote:
Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:10 pm
Yazi: He wouldn't have had any reason to have an implant in the past, not until he learned about Agnika Kaieru as we saw in the flashback. Either that, or I suppose his research found a safer way of installing it.

Gaelio's attitude towards Mika seems pretty pragmatic to me; he realizes that they were enemy combatants and that there was literally nothing personal behind it, plus everything that's happened seems to have made him "grow up" a bit (at least in terms of abandoning his earlier knightly idealism). He hates McGillis because he spent years trying to become McGillis' friend, only to get emotionally back-stabbed (and literally front-stabbed).
That not the impression I got at all not when the show back in season 1 was pushing the whole Ein and Gaelio relationship, while I may not be a big fan of Ein, Know Gaelio did like him and that fact Mika Killed him ( lets face it this episode pretty much Confirmed Ein is dead no matter how you slice it ) the hate Gaelio would have would also greatly help Mika's Character at the same time making orga's character strong that was the impression I got when he came back as Vidar, a win win , for everyone when you think about it.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by yazi88 » Sun Feb 12, 2017 11:18 pm

I'm not sure what rivalry people are talking about here with Gaileo's conflict with Mika in season 1... Gaileo was doing his job and also held prejudice and looked down on people on Mars... Ein being the only exception... The big development here is that either Gaileo put that prejudice behind him with Mika or McGillis takes priority over everything... I'm guessing Gaileo probably wised up after lots of reflecting at how much of a jerk he was being especially being with Ein with looking down on people from Mars.

I doubt he really is mad at Mika despite him killing Gjharrhorn soldiers and Mika was the one who killed Carta but McGillis was the one who iniated it. These things happen on the battlefield with Mika, and Gjarrhorn were the ones who attacked Tekkadan everytime aside from the final battle at Edmonton in season 1.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Kuruni » Sun Feb 12, 2017 11:43 pm

Well, Gaelio used to look down on Mika because he's Martian and has AV-implant ...which is exactly what Ein become in the end. And now Gaelio himself might has AV too (or at least ability to connect to Ein)

He is clearly become more mature than S1, so I guess he just realize that it was nonsense and hypocritical. Likely he'll fight Mika as a respectable opponent from now on.

One more thing. If it would reveal that Kaieru is really be inside Bael, then it would be foreshadow of Mika's (half of him is inside Barbatos already...).
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