SEED Destiny SE

RoninWanderer · Sun Jul 22, 2007 1:38 am

If you have seen it, how was it?

I heard that the special edition was made to "fix" the problems from the original series. I have avoided watching Destiny because of all the bad press it seems to get, though I enjoyed SEED a lot. So, if you have seen it, is it 'better' than the series, or is it a bit like the Seed SE where its kind of lacking in quality.

Nightwing03 · Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:12 am

It's basically added extra scenes, only a few new things, you can find em at wikipedia, but overall it was better than the original series...but im not sure about fixing the bad things in SEED...and theres one SE that has alot of fanservice..

Mwulf · Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:13 am

It's pretty decent if you don't want to bother with the series, and since everyting is so compressed you don't get the whole "WTF" from the fourth coul.

I'd still say the anime is better, because several of the early episodes are pretty good. Watch the first three couls (to 36 or so) the same way you watch Wing--completely ignoring any and all philosophical dialogue--and you'll probably like it.

Vyron · Sun Jul 22, 2007 4:19 am

Nightwing03 wrote:...and theres one SE that has alot of fanservice..

Which EP is it? Which characters?

Bremics · Sun Jul 22, 2007 4:54 am

Vyron wrote:
Nightwing03 wrote:...and theres one SE that has alot of fanservice..
Which EP is it? Which characters?

Naked Lacus... think it was second?

Ork_dreadnought · Sun Jul 22, 2007 5:06 am

Bremics wrote:
Vyron wrote:
Nightwing03 wrote:...and theres one SE that has alot of fanservice..
Which EP is it? Which characters?
Naked Lacus... think it was second?

Don't we get that from the original SEED opening sequence anyway?

You know, I'd never thought I'd have to ask that

Koshernova · Sun Jul 22, 2007 8:41 am

Mwulf wrote:It's pretty decent if you don't want to bother with the series, and since everyting is so compressed you don't get the whole "WTF" from the fourth coul.

I'd still say the anime is better, because several of the early episodes are pretty good. Watch the first three couls (to 36 or so) the same way you watch Wing--completely ignoring any and all philosophical dialogue--and you'll probably like it.

Pardon my ignorance, but what does "coul" mean?

Sun Jul 22, 2007 1:34 pm

If you've heard that the SEs "fix" things, you've been listening to incorrect fan speculation and fan hopes about what the SEs should be, not what they are. There's no way to "fix" the later half of DESTINY without completely rewriting and reanimating the story. All you'll find in the SEs are a few minor new scenes, some reanimated parts, and minor technical fixes, such as adding wind resistance when Lunamaria is trying to shoot Djibril's shuttle, or having Saviour Phase Shift down when it gets sliced up by Freedom. Other than that, it's just a straight up compilation of the series, minus some extraneous elements. It may tell the story a bit better, but at the end of the day, it's still the same story.

RoninWanderer · Sun Jul 22, 2007 1:37 pm

Thanks, i guess i'll just watch normal Destiny, not wait for the movies

OpMegs · Sun Jul 22, 2007 2:11 pm

Ork_dreadnought wrote:
Bremics wrote:
Vyron wrote:Which EP is it? Which characters?
Naked Lacus... think it was second?
Don't we get that from the original SEED opening sequence anyway?

You know, I'd never thought I'd have to ask that

I'm pretty sure we got pretty much naked everyone but Durandal thanks to the third SEED Destiny opening.

And yeah, that was pretty much the point of the SEs, wasn't it? Additional scenes (presumably plot related) and fanservice? Cagalli's bath at Andy's in SEED SE being turned into an upright shower for fanservice purposes comes to mind.

Volnixshin · Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:18 pm

What does COUL mean? Like Kosh, I do not understand.

ShadowCell · Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:40 pm

If I recall correctly, a coul is how the Japanese organize their TV shows. A coul is about thirteen episodes long, so a show like DESTINY would have been four couls long.

I think.

Vyron · Tue Jul 24, 2007 2:34 am

So its just the word that denotes the average length of a season of an anime in Japan (around 13 eps)?

Mwulf · Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:28 am

ShadowCell wrote:If I recall correctly, a coul is how the Japanese organize their TV shows. A coul is about thirteen episodes long, so a show like DESTINY would have been four couls long.

I think.

Correct. A coul is essentially analogous to a "season" in the U.S.. Each year is divided into 4 couls, IIRC, for each season (Summer, Winter, Spring and Autumn).

Most anime and jdoramas run a for a single coul, which is about 12 episodes, +/-1. A few go up to two couls, which is about 25 episodes (again, +/-1) and others go as far as 4 couls (50 episodes, +/-2). And then there are the myriad of shounens that run indefinitely.

Revolver Ocelot · Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:41 am

Don't listen to the bad press about Gundam SEED Destiny. Watch it and judge for yourself. A lot of the bad press any Gundam saga gets typically boils down to "It's not UC. Wah wah.." GSD is my favorite Gundam TV series. You have to really delve into the outer reaches of nitpicky in order to try to insult this show, something hardcore Gundam fanatics are really good at.

In the end, the only person's opinion you can trust is yours. Watch the show and try to enjoy it. That's all I can say.

Tue Jul 24, 2007 10:10 am

Revolver Ocelot wrote:GSD is my favorite Gundam TV series. You have to really delve into the outer reaches of nitpicky in order to try to insult this show, something hardcore Gundam fanatics are really good at.

I'm going to have to disagree with you, because DESTINY definitely has a long list of faults. I'm not going to get into them here, because my opinions are in my reviews. On the flip side of things, whereas some are too prone to bash, perhaps you're too prone to be forgiving. No anime or form of entertainment out there is perfect. Even my favorite Gundam shows, the original and Zeta, are flawed. Every Gundam series is flawed in some fashion or another, just like every form of entertainment. And it's not just minor, nitpicky details, but legitimate issues. Even if it's your favorite, that doesn't mean it's perfect or somehow above criticism.

Revolver Ocelot · Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:45 pm

I'm not too forgiving. It's just that our ideas of what a true offense is differ greatly. For me, the biggest crime ever committed in a Gundam saga is the music in 0080. It's really cheesy and doesn't fit with the scenes, especially the serious or tragic ones, at all. That pisses me off more than anything any other Gundam show has done. Now, you and other people might think that music is a moot point, but it's a big deal to me. Some people go nuts over animation quality. Some people love lots of fight scenes and some people act like it's a crime to a series to have more than one fight scene a season. It's all relative.

When I watched GSD, I was honestly at a loss when it came to where all the bitching came from. If there was something seriously wrong with this series beyond the typical Gundam blights, it must have gone way over my head.

And yeah, I've read your reviews and I don't agree with them at all. There's a lot of bias and jaded panning. The last episode of GSD gets 2 but the last episode of MSG gets a perfect 5? If that's not playing favorites.. whooboy. But I don't really complain about it because that's honestly how you felt. Does it mean GSD had more faults than any other Gundam saga? No. It just means the faults in GSD meant more to you than a lot of the others. Just because I'm not out for blood doesn't mean I'm glossing. It all comes down to how you felt about it personally, which is why I say watch GSD and judge for yourself.

And when it comes down to the TV show vs. the movies, well, I pretty much share the same opinion about all the Gundam compilation movies: stick with the series. The only exceptions are the original Gundam movie trilogy and the Endless Waltz movie.

Nagi · Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:51 pm

Revolver Ocelot wrote:A lot of the bad press any Gundam saga gets typically boils down to "It's not UC. Wah wah.."

Most of my favorite Gundam series aren't Universal Century, yet I still hate Destiny. Even as a fan of the first SEED and Astray, I still hate Destiny. Not everything in the Gundam fanbase is some "us vs. them," UC vs. AU thing. A lot of us judge each show on its individual merits and don't do stupid biases.

Revolver Ocelot wrote:You have to really delve into the outer reaches of nitpicky in order to try to insult this show,

It doesn't even have a plot half the time (I still love that part where they're sitting in the Indian Ocean repeating the same battle for like eighteen episodes), the script is blatantly rewritten in places, and characters' personalities are changed on the fly (including turning the lead character into a second-rate toadie). Nitpicking is saying things like Sting wasn't developed enough as a character (which...he wasn't), but these are major, glaring issues that reach over the entirety of the series.

Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:52 pm

Revolver Ocelot wrote:When I watched GSD, I was honestly at a loss when it came to where all the bitching came from. If there was something seriously wrong with this series beyond the typical Gundam blights, it must have gone way over my head.

And yeah, I've read your reviews and I don't agree with them at all. There's a lot of bias and jaded panning. The last episode of GSD gets 2 but the last episode of MSG gets a perfect 5? If that's not playing favorites.. whooboy. But I don't really complain about it because that's honestly how you felt. Does it mean GSD had more faults than any other Gundam saga? No. It just means the faults in GSD meant more to you than a lot of the others. Just because I'm not out for blood doesn't mean I'm glossing. It all comes down to how you felt about it personally, which is why I say watch GSD and judge for yourself.

I'm really tired of having the term "bias" thrown in my face time and time again. If I critically judge something and don't like it for various listed reasons, why does that make me 'biased'? What's wrong with giving the last episode of MSG a 5 if I think it was superior to GSD's finale? How is that being "biased?" Reviewing something critically is not the same thing as being "out for blood." I gave the second half of SEED positive ratings, and the first half of GSD got pretty positive reviews (particularly the first 13 or so episodes). I feel to see how there's any "bias" in pointing out legitimate faults of a series. And though you're perfectly entitled to your own opinion, if you can look at all of GSD and honestly say you don't find a single serious fault with it, you're definitely softballing it.

Mwulf · Tue Jul 24, 2007 4:07 pm

dammit, of course you're biased, Chris. You're SUPPOSED to be biased. That's the whole point of a review. I don't know what an unbiased review would look like, but I can't imagine it being more than a summary.

Chris wrote:...if you can look at all of GSD and honestly say you don't find a single serious fault with it, you're definitely softballing it.

That's for sure. And forget opinion-stuff, there are measurable empirical faults as well. Like, say, using identical footages from Seed's last battle for Destiny's last battle, or the animation for mobile suits morphing into other mobile suits.