Greatest Gundam Villians/Evil Moments

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Post by Cardi Doorl » Mon Feb 26, 2007 11:33 am

ZeonfromHell wrote:BTW, do we know if he had his own "Holocaust" in the Side 3 colonies?
Nope, though he's known to have conducted purges of those with suspect loyalties (or with more loyalty to the late Zeon Zum Deikun than to the Zabi family), but that's something a lot of evil dictators do.

Given the Nazification of Zeon over the last decade, though, I wouldn't be surprised if they suddenly, God forbid, retconned in a Holocaust-esque event during the OYW :?
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Post by Thundermuffin » Mon Feb 26, 2007 1:46 pm

Does Shinn Asuka count? Cause if he does...I wouldn't pick him. :)

I'd have to go with Gihren. Patricide seems pretty high up there on the list of evil acts.

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Post by wing zero alpha » Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:34 pm

Gym Ghingham: Possibly my favorite Gundam villain period. Gym was a brute of a man, but he had style to him and a "I'm-above-these-plebes" attitude to match. As well, instead of being some random dictator or desk man with a two-bit philosophy of how humans should be, Gym was the warrior type straight to the end that just loved war and chaos; that's a rarity in Gundam, since the only other character I can think of like that is Yazan Gable. Oh yeah, and he had the most powerful mobile suit in any Gundam universe.

Haman Karn: Points already mentioned. The retcons of CDA aside, Haman was a cunning and manipulative woman that played both sides of a conflict and came out on top. She was probably the closest villain to taking over the Earth, and I have no doubts she and Neo Zeon could have accomplished this if it weren't for her half-hearted attitude in ZZ and Glemy Toto's betrayal. And again, she had a really cool MS and fighting style to her (remote weapons ftw).

Paptimus Scirocco: I think he's overrated for the most part, especially with his so-called "charisma" (when he got close to Reccoa the first time, it reminded me of that creepy guy you see in a subway) and skills as a pilot (never saw him do anything special with the Messala or The O). However, the man was a genius and a skilled manipulator who knew how to play people like cards, albeit not to Haman's level. I especially liked it in Operation Apollo when he had the Dogos Gear move to the front of the Titans fleet without deploying MS, that way the Alexandria and the other Titans ships would take the brunt of the AEUG attack while the Gear was the one that landed on the Moon. That was clever if anything.

Gilbert Durandal: We all know how GSD went down, but I think Durandal deserves an honorable mention. He was a pretty charismatic character before he got preachy with the Destiny Plan, and for most of the series you really couldn't nail the guy as a villain; he seemed benevolent and most of his declarations and policies were justified at the beginning (since the EA were being the "real" bad guys). In fact, the only real clue that he was going to be a villain was his choice of seiyuu. So yes, points to Durandal for being hard to pick out at the beginning.

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Post by Antares » Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:36 pm

I also like Gihren from UC. He is capable of rational thought, and then again so was Rau until he got all foamy at the mouth. Which, as many people have said, was very entertaining. Plus he shot Fllay just for the heck of it. The one thing that would've made him totally evul would've been to whack both Dearka and Yzak and their sub-standard Gundams. Nothing like killing your former subordinates even when they can't fight your superior firepower (as Dearka found out). And also mentioned the Frost brothers were pretty cool, but they got lamed so bad in the end I felt sorry for them for going through all the trouble and in the end even ending up alive. Poor sods. :P

EDIT: To wza: In book my book Gilbert would've received more honor if he hadn't dropped the ball completely and being only a step short from getting foamy too. The man indeed had an excellent facade up, but then gambled it away.

It's hard to find an evil guy who is rational and capable. You usually have only one or the other. Or then just spittle, in great abundance.
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Post by Phantomexe87 » Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:37 pm

Having a Holocaust in Side 3 would make little sense, as Gihren was just against Earthnoids... and possibly Lunarians, although I doubt that, as the Zeon were liked in Granada and Von Braun. Most of the Zabi's political enemies had already been killed by Degwin, who lost one of his sons in the process.

As for patricide... well then Kamille could be considered evil too, that and trying to kill a Titan with a Gundam, just for hitting him.

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Post by Wedge14 » Mon Feb 26, 2007 2:41 pm

He didn't get as much screen time as these other baddies but the colonel Killing dude from war in the pocket was a pretty bad dude. He was willing to kill his own men. And DID!
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Post by WingZero20xx » Mon Feb 26, 2007 3:31 pm

norris' battle against the 8th MS team was pretty good

also the cyclops team's attack on the feddie base in antartica was good too

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Post by RedShirt0909 » Mon Feb 26, 2007 3:51 pm

Antares wrote:I also like Gihren from UC. He is capable of rational thought, and then again so was Rau until he got all foamy at the mouth. Which, as many people have said, was very entertaining. Plus he shot Fllay just for the heck of it. The one thing that would've made him totally evul would've been to whack both Dearka and Yzak and their sub-standard Gundams. Nothing like killing your former subordinates even when they can't fight your superior firepower (as Dearka found out). And also mentioned the
One thing on Rau he DID set Yzak up to die during Spitbreak - if you'll recall, he sent him after the Archangel when he knew the Cyclops would go off soon. Yzak only lived because Kira disabled him and forced him to withdraw before the big kaboom. Rau was a pure psycho to try and off the only member of his team he had left, especially the one with no qualms about killing anyone and the pilot of Zaft's best MS at the time (Justice wasn't introduced for another episode and Kira had jacked the Freedom already).
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Post by Shinji103 » Mon Feb 26, 2007 4:58 pm

RedShirt0909 wrote:
Antares wrote:I also like Gihren from UC. He is capable of rational thought, and then again so was Rau until he got all foamy at the mouth. Which, as many people have said, was very entertaining. Plus he shot Fllay just for the heck of it. The one thing that would've made him totally evul would've been to whack both Dearka and Yzak and their sub-standard Gundams. Nothing like killing your former subordinates even when they can't fight your superior firepower (as Dearka found out). And also mentioned the
One thing on Rau he DID set Yzak up to die during Spitbreak - if you'll recall, he sent him after the Archangel when he knew the Cyclops would go off soon. Yzak only lived because Kira disabled him and forced him to withdraw before the big kaboom. Rau was a pure psycho to try and off the only member of his team he had left, especially the one with no qualms about killing anyone and the pilot of Zaft's best MS at the time (Justice wasn't introduced for another episode and Kira had jacked the Freedom already).
Mmmeh, this seems to be a big misunderstanding that I see somewhat often. I must point out that Yzak said he was going inside the base until Rau told him about the AA guarding the main gate. Thus, by sending Yzak after the AA instead of letting him go inside the base, Rau knocked up Yzak's survival rate jumped by a very good margin.

a) Yzak goes inside the about-to-self-destruct base.

b) Yzak goes after the AA which is outside the about-to-self-destruct base and fleeing the area.

It's pretty clear which route has the better chance for survival, and Rau pointed him down it. If Rau had wanted to send Yzak out to his death, he would have stayed quiet and let him go inside the base. And Rau can't just tell an elite soldier to sit out of a major decisive battle. It would look very odd.

Not that Rau actually cared about Yzak. He just knew that Yzak was still useful and wanted to keep him around longer to use him. So no, Rau didn't send Yzak to his death.

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Post by "Kamille! Kamille! » Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:33 pm

How about Treize? I love characters like him, Char, Shagia, and Katejina who manipulate others to get their own way. Probably my four favorite Gundam villains right there. Papty is growing on me.

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Post by Crusader » Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:53 pm

Frost brothers: When Garroad gets the Double X, and they kill Aimzat after telling him about thier plans. He treated them well and it was very sinister for them to off him.

Lady Une: She slaps Noin after a vicious campaign against the Gundams, plus she talked down to Zechs on top of it. That shines.

Fuala Griffen: She deffinitly gets on the list, after having that old guy beheaded, then here behavior in space. Just splendid.

Cima: Didn't like her, but she Betrayed the hopes of Zeon, and she executed Delaz.

Trieze: (for the reasons mentioned above)

Azreal: For shooting Natarle, then temporarily retiring mu from action.

Jibiril: He enjoyed Destroy's rampage, but then he fires reqiuem on the plants.

Valder Farkill: He kills broom, then He kills Soris and Luna, who were loyal to him above all else.

lastly Captain Ryer: He sacrifices his own ment to achieve victory, and he makes life miserable for the 8th Ms team.

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Post by YazanGable » Mon Feb 26, 2007 7:08 pm

Since I'm amazed this moment hasn't come up yet...
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Post by ShadowCell » Mon Feb 26, 2007 7:23 pm

I'll give it to Basque Om. Unlike Dullindal and Gihren and Treize, Basque didn't need to build a fancy rationale for why he was killing people or what he ultimately wanted; he just killed people because he could. And unlike Yazan, Basque was in a position to do it millions of times over.

Who else, when asked "Why did you do it?" at their war crimes trial, can say "Because I could"?

Basque be da man.

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Post by Volnixshin » Mon Feb 26, 2007 10:33 pm

Ash Grey

Because he wasn't told he had to kill people, he didn't need a fancy reason to do so, he wasn't out to save someone from someone. He just loved killing. He wanted to kill kill kill kill and kill. And he'd use anyweapon to do so. Which is cool cause he had a gun that could take out a fortress in one shot. Personally I would love to see Jesus Yamato being confounded everytime he shot off one of Ashs limbs only to have another one attach itself.

I think unlike Rau, who wants to kill all of humanity, Ash wouldn't be satisified, and just kill every living thing, that's his character, hew ould make it so there is ABSOLUTLY NO life on earth whatsoever.


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Post by Genocide » Mon Feb 26, 2007 11:02 pm

I think we've had a similar thread like this before. In my opinion, the "evilest" characters in Gundam would have to be Rau, Gym, Ulube, Lacus, the Frosts, Ginias, Iron Mask, Crux Dogatie and Katejina. I'm pretty sure all of my choices are fairly self explanitory. From the sound of it, Ash Grey also scores pretty high on the evil chart.

I think people like Scirocco, Gihren and Treize are a bit iffy, since they are more ambitious than evil. People like Master Asia, Char, Haman and Zechs could also fall under this category. Also, I can't see what's so evil about Yazan. He's a soldier, and therefore he kills because he has to. Him enjoying it is just a little extra for himself and makes his role easier. For all we know, he could have been one of the random Jegan pilots trying to push Axis away at the end of CCA... >_>

PS: As for evilest moment, it has to be either when Ulube attacks the Earth with the Devil Gundam or when Katejina stabs Uso after tricking him. I can't really think of anything else at the moment in Gundam that matches those two scenes in terms of evilness. Although I know we've seen plenty of times mass genocide attempted, most of the results (such as the massive colony drop in AW) seem more tragic than evil. Many times they also serve a purpose, somewhat like political terrorism and an attempt at ending a war (not that the methods are right). With the Devil Gundam however, well, the name says it all. Ulube basically did what he did for his own personal and selfish desires. And although I know Katejina stabbing Uso wasn't exactly the end of the human race or anything, it did show just how cruel she was and did it in a way that even killing millions of innocent people with a WMD couldn't reflect.

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Post by wizerdman5 » Tue Feb 27, 2007 12:59 am

Rau Le Creuset: at the end of the series when he kills flay and everyone else on that shuttle.

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Post by Volnixshin » Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:16 pm

Just to back up my previous post as I did some thinking, in the CE universe I don't think you COULD get more eviler than Ash. Rau Le Crueset believed he had a good reason to do such a thing, he believed he was a victim. Patrick Zala also believed he was doing the right thing for his people, twisted but he thought it would be the best thing for his race, same with djbril and Azreal, they felt threatened by their opponents. All these people believe what they're doing is the right path. Ash isnt in it for saving his people, he doesn't want the betterment of mankind, he's not lashing out because he hates humanity, he isn't trying to justify anything. He just wants to kill, it makes him happy.

Of course we all wish he had succeeded in his last official mission to kill Lacus Clyne. :D
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Post by ORegan » Tue Feb 27, 2007 10:09 pm

i pick the iron mask guy from f91, he tried to fufill that comso babylon thing, which im not to sure of, but involves killing a **** load of ppl with those bugs...thats pretty evil to send a hoard of flying spinning knives at people.
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Post by Cybaster » Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:29 pm

I'm going to pick Karozo as well --- you really don't see many villains in Gundam (short of G) that physically (by himself, no less, not accounting Mobile Suits just yet) just won't die no matter how much punishment he takes; He's been shot at twice, the first shot a sniper's bullet that his mask takes for him, the second from Cecily in desperation when he personally reaches out of the Lafressia to grab and toss her into space. It actually connects to his arm (in a vacuum, no less), and Karozo just shrugs the whole thing off. You don't see Char Aznable capable of doing *that*.

That second bullet also answers why it would've been equally useless to just 'aim for his body'. :P

Plus, the Lafressia is, hands-down save the Divinidad from Crossbone Gundam, the most powerful Mobile Armor in Universal Century history, and Karozo kicked an entire fleet's butt with it, plus Cecily in the Vigna Ghina (no puny machine that stood up to the F-91). It's virtually hundreds of Zeongs in Super Saiyan mode. XD
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Post by wing zero alpha » Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:29 am

Genocide wrote:In my opinion, the "evilest" characters in Gundam would have to be Rau, Gym, Ulube, Lacus, the Frosts, Ginias, Iron Mask, Crux Dogatie and Katejina.
Opinions of Lacus' views aside, I still wouldn't put her on the same list as those people. That'd be like putting Laura Bush or Hillary Clinton on the same line as Adolf Hitler or Joseph Stalin, it just doesn't compare (although I'm sure there are people on this board that think so).
I think people like Scirocco, Gihren and Treize are a bit iffy, since they are more ambitious than evil. People like Master Asia, Char, Haman and Zechs could also fall under this category.
Well, the first three wanted to take over the world and subject it to what their views of humanity should be force (especially Gihren). That's a pretty fair description of "evil", and it's been used on many a dictator. Asia, Char and Zechs on the other hand wanted to destroy the world and kill many innocent people, which again also falls under the general description of "evil", and again it's been used to describe the various purges made by people like Hitler, Stalin, Mao, Hussein, etc. Yes, I know Asia had a noble cause in mind, but it doesn't excuse the fact he tried to wipe out humanity.
Also, I can't see what's so evil about Yazan. He's a soldier, and therefore he kills because he has to. Him enjoying it is just a little extra for himself and makes his role easier. For all we know, he could have been one of the random Jegan pilots trying to push Axis away at the end of CCA... >_>
I agree Yazan isn't really an "evil" guy, not the same as the people above anyway. However, he's definitely not a "good" guy either; he's along the lines of a berserker if anything.
Although I know we've seen plenty of times mass genocide attempted, most of the results (such as the massive colony drop in AW) seem more tragic than evil. Many times they also serve a purpose, somewhat like political terrorism and an attempt at ending a war (not that the methods are right). With the Devil Gundam however, well, the name says it all. Ulube basically did what he did for his own personal and selfish desires.
And you think Gihren, Jamitov, Bask, Char and the members of the Crossbone Vanguard and Zanscare Empire were killing people for something other than their personal and selfish desires? All of them were again dictating how they thought humanity should be and shouldn't be, as if they themselves were on some higher level than the rest; to me, you can't get anymore arrogant or selfish than that. I'd say the same for Zechs, but at least he redeemed himself in the end.
And although I know Katejina stabbing Uso wasn't exactly the end of the human race or anything, it did show just how cruel she was and did it in a way that even killing millions of innocent people with a WMD couldn't reflect.
That I'll agree with as well. It shows there are ways of making a proper villain/villainess without having to turn him/her into a mass murderer.

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