do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

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bhayes82
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do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by bhayes82 » Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:02 pm

just curious..in the original series there's a line from Tem Ray that the Gundam is being prepared for mass production

Thunderbolt, 0080, 08th Team and other mangas- reveal that other Gundams were created during the one year war

is this a contracticion to the original series? The impression left by the original series is that the federation has ONE gundam and fewer mobile suits until near the end of the series.

but the Alex was created for 0080, Gundams were mass-produced in 08th Team, and a gundam was created for Pilot Io Fleming in Thunderbolt.

OTHER gundams were made & destroyed in the one year war. is this a contradiction to the original series?

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by Kuruni » Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:49 pm

How? Thoae two things arwn't relevant. RX-79 are especially noted to be made from parts left over from developing Gundam (not quite good enough, but still functional) Alex was made afterward for Amuro. Thunderbolt's author doesn't really mind continuity, but I can't see what would prevent Federation to made few more prototypes.
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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by SonicSP » Wed Jan 06, 2021 3:18 am

There is no canon in Gundam, anything goes. They will try to fit it but if there's a contradiction here and there, they just roll with it.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by bhayes82 » Wed Jan 06, 2021 7:41 am

SonicSP wrote:
Wed Jan 06, 2021 3:18 am
There is no canon in Gundam, anything goes. They will try to fit it but if there's a contradiction here and there, they just roll with it.
ha ha ha.. Good Point. Or rather they find creative ways to re-invent the canon so that it fits.
Kuruni wrote:
Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:49 pm
How? Thoae two things arwn't relevant. RX-79 are especially noted to be made from parts left over from developing Gundam (not quite good enough, but still functional) Alex was made afterward for Amuro. Thunderbolt's author doesn't really mind continuity, but I can't see what would prevent Federation to made few more prototypes.
good point. in thunderbolt Io Fleming makes a comment about how 'no wonder the federation is sending out so many prototypes to new pilots' that's a dry reference to the original series, 0080 & 08th team but the original series leaves 'the impression' that there's only one gundam. they never say it explicitly.

the OAV's leave the impression that near the end of the war there were several prototypes built and destroyed in little skirmishes that no one knows about. and in those battles the participants know about white base & heard about the 'legendary' gundam but nothing about the pilot.

I've been watching thunderbolt. it's actually pretty cool movie series. i hope they continue that series someday.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by Mafty » Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:00 am

SonicSP wrote:
Wed Jan 06, 2021 3:18 am
There is no canon in Gundam, anything goes. They will try to fit it but if there's a contradiction here and there, they just roll with it.
It goes beyond just the amount of Gundam's in the One Year War...

The first series say that EVERY side other than Side 3(Zeon), Side 6 (neutral) and Side 7 (all of half a colony , which gets attacked anyway) were completely Destroyed. In Zeta and ZZ suddenly there are dozens if not hundreds of colonies in Sides 1 and 2 (many of which are implicitly older than Side 7) and Sides 4 and 5 are retconned into being the only ones destroyed.

The city destroyed by Operation British is never named in the original series, Later it's stated to be Sydney (Despite Sydney being mentioned by Bernie in War In The Pocket).

The GM's and Zaku's are introduced much later in the war in the first series, than in pretty much every prequel.

And then there's all the Zeon remnants who show up in Unicorn despite the fact that they(and all their older mecha) were nowhere to be seen in Char's Counterattack.

It makes sense really that continuity is going to change. When they were doing the original series nobody knew that the show was going to be popular enough to turn into a decades long franchise. so retconning to make the story for exciting/entertaining. It's all fictional anyway so why not play with continuity if it makes the story work better?

Look at Macross for instance; it has multiple versions of the same story, all of which are basically canon. Even without side stories Gundam has different continuity between the series and compilation movies.

Also who knows if this is a rumor or not, but isn't their speculation of Sunrise remaking the original series, or at least adapting more of The Origin. I don't think this it going to happen but it would be cool if they tried to merge all the One Year war stories together

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by MythSearcher » Sun Jan 10, 2021 5:43 am

Mafty wrote:
Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:00 am
It goes beyond just the amount of Gundam's in the One Year War...

The first series say that EVERY side other than Side 3(Zeon), Side 6 (neutral) and Side 7 (all of half a colony , which gets attacked anyway) were completely Destroyed. In Zeta and ZZ suddenly there are dozens if not hundreds of colonies in Sides 1 and 2 (many of which are implicitly older than Side 7) and Sides 4 and 5 are retconned into being the only ones destroyed.

The city destroyed by Operation British is never named in the original series, Later it's stated to be Sydney (Despite Sydney being mentioned by Bernie in War In The Pocket).

The GM's and Zaku's are introduced much later in the war in the first series, than in pretty much every prequel.

And then there's all the Zeon remnants who show up in Unicorn despite the fact that they(and all their older mecha) were nowhere to be seen in Char's Counterattack.

It makes sense really that continuity is going to change. When they were doing the original series nobody knew that the show was going to be popular enough to turn into a decades long franchise. so retconning to make the story for exciting/entertaining. It's all fictional anyway so why not play with continuity if it makes the story work better?
I don't think they say every side other than those are destroyed, they actually stayed in Side 5 (Texas Colony), and it was left with minimal personnel because of the war. The damage is devastating, but not completely destroyed. Zeon destroyed the ones with EFSF soldiers and personnel in them, but probably just keep the others for logistics reasons.

Sydney was mentioned as early as Gundam Century, even the name Operation British was only given in Gundam Century and not in the anime itself. Also, they have very little depiction about the colony drop in the anime. If you read the original proposal, there should be around 40 colony drops in the beginning, then over half of Side 2 and 5's colonies were dropped. Yes, they changed a lot of the settings just from 1978 to 1981. BTW, at the time Gundam Century was more of a fan book(actually, pretty much still is) so we don't really have a lot of information of whether the official settings were changed or not at the time. It was pretty much until 0083 that we see they included a lot of the Gundam Century info about the colony drop and confirms its canonity.(that only one was dropped and on Sydney, notice in 0080 they can still casually talked about Sydney not really knowing it was destroyed) They also didn't really have anything in the proposal and script about how they obtained the colony(s) to be dropped, it was only in the novel where it stated that GG gas was used.

But Zakus are in the very first episode, and GMs are seen in Jaburo, I don't think any series have made it much earlier than the first other than The ORIGIN, which have a completely different MS development history than any other series and the settings, to a point where they are publishing settings for the ORIGIN separately and call it that.(https://www.amazon.co.jp/dp/4802192614/) Instead of trying to fit it in with other series.
Also who knows if this is a rumor or not, but isn't their speculation of Sunrise remaking the original series, or at least adapting more of The Origin. I don't think this it going to happen but it would be cool if they tried to merge all the One Year war stories together
That was cancelled.
Yoshikazu Yasuhiko said he proposed to Sunrise to reboot the series with the ORIGIN crew (Studio 1?) but later confirmed the proposal was rejected, some speculates that it is because of his age.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by bhayes82 » Tue Jan 12, 2021 3:45 am

MythSearcher wrote:
Sun Jan 10, 2021 5:43 am
Mafty wrote:
Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:00 am
It goes beyond just the amount of Gundam's in the One Year War...

The first series say that EVERY side other than Side 3(Zeon), Side 6 (neutral) and Side 7 (all of half a colony , which gets attacked anyway) were completely Destroyed. In Zeta and ZZ suddenly there are dozens if not hundreds of colonies in Sides 1 and 2 (many of which are implicitly older than Side 7) and Sides 4 and 5 are retconned into being the only ones destroyed.

The city destroyed by Operation British is never named in the original series, Later it's stated to be Sydney (Despite Sydney being mentioned by Bernie in War In The Pocket).

The GM's and Zaku's are introduced much later in the war in the first series, than in pretty much every prequel.

And then there's all the Zeon remnants who show up in Unicorn despite the fact that they(and all their older mecha) were nowhere to be seen in Char's Counterattack.

It makes sense really that continuity is going to change. When they were doing the original series nobody knew that the show was going to be popular enough to turn into a decades long franchise. so retconning to make the story for exciting/entertaining. It's all fictional anyway so why not play with continuity if it makes the story work better?
I don't think they say every side other than those are destroyed, they actually stayed in Side 5 (Texas Colony), and it was left with minimal personnel because of the war. The damage is devastating, but not completely destroyed. Zeon destroyed the ones with EFSF soldiers and personnel in them, but probably just keep the others for logistics reasons.

Sydney was mentioned as early as Gundam Century, even the name Operation British was only given in Gundam Century and not in the anime itself. Also, they have very little depiction about the colony drop in the anime. If you read the original proposal, there should be around 40 colony drops in the beginning, then over half of Side 2 and 5's colonies were dropped. Yes, they changed a lot of the settings just from 1978 to 1981. BTW, at the time Gundam Century was more of a fan book(actually, pretty much still is) so we don't really have a lot of information of whether the official settings were changed or not at the time. It was pretty much until 0083 that we see they included a lot of the Gundam Century info about the colony drop and confirms its canonity.(that only one was dropped and on Sydney, notice in 0080 they can still casually talked about Sydney not really knowing it was destroyed) They also didn't really have anything in the proposal and script about how they obtained the colony(s) to be dropped, it was only in the novel where it stated that GG gas was used.

But Zakus are in the very first episode, and GMs are seen in Jaburo, I don't think any series have made it much earlier than the first other than The ORIGIN, which have a completely different MS development history than any other series and the settings, to a point where they are publishing settings for the ORIGIN separately and call it that.(https://www.amazon.co.jp/dp/4802192614/) Instead of trying to fit it in with other series.
Also who knows if this is a rumor or not, but isn't their speculation of Sunrise remaking the original series, or at least adapting more of The Origin. I don't think this it going to happen but it would be cool if they tried to merge all the One Year war stories together
That was cancelled.
Yoshikazu Yasuhiko said he proposed to Sunrise to reboot the series with the ORIGIN crew (Studio 1?) but later confirmed the proposal was rejected, some speculates that it is because of his age.
really? Cancelled? where's your source for this info?

so what was this news from him that he's working on something 'related' to the first gundam?

https://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/ ... rst-gundam

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by Kuruni » Tue Jan 12, 2021 9:45 am

The news was from the last year. Alot of things happen since then that even Olympic might got cancelled.

BTW, adding a massive block of quotes for replying to the post above you with only three lines of actual content is utter impressive. I think I have dirty joke to tell here, but nah...
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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by MythSearcher » Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:24 am

bhayes82 wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 3:45 am

really? Cancelled? where's your source for this info?

so what was this news from him that he's working on something 'related' to the first gundam?

https://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/ ... rst-gundam
I saw the quote from an official tweet in a forum, but if you ask me which tweet it is, I don't have the link.

Though I will admit that both Yasuhiko & Tomino said they are working on a first Gundam related project around the time of your quote, so while Yasuhiko said he isn't going to be directing a GTO version of first Gundam reboot, maybe Tomino is.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by bhayes82 » Tue Jan 12, 2021 1:01 pm

MythSearcher wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:24 am
bhayes82 wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 3:45 am

really? Cancelled? where's your source for this info?

so what was this news from him that he's working on something 'related' to the first gundam?

https://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/ ... rst-gundam
I saw the quote from an official tweet in a forum, but if you ask me which tweet it is, I don't have the link.

Though I will admit that both Yasuhiko & Tomino said they are working on a first Gundam related project around the time of your quote, so while Yasuhiko said he isn't going to be directing a GTO version of first Gundam reboot, maybe Tomino is.
oh noooooooo!!! so its official. that 'first gundam' related project is dead? ok well it was a nice dream. I'll forget it and just be thankful for the new Hathaway trilogy coming

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by MythSearcher » Wed Jan 13, 2021 4:26 am

bhayes82 wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 1:01 pm

oh noooooooo!!! so its official. that 'first gundam' related project is dead? ok well it was a nice dream. I'll forget it and just be thankful for the new Hathaway trilogy coming
It's official that Yasuhiko announced that his work as a director will not continue into the "main plot" of GTO.(meaning the parts where overlaps with first Gundam and his proposal of doing that part was cancelled, which is related to an earlier tweet he said about he proposed to continue producing the rest of GTO after the prequel parts.

No body said anything about whether that is the first Gundam related project they were talking about or not.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by bhayes82 » Wed Jan 13, 2021 3:21 pm

MythSearcher wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 4:26 am
bhayes82 wrote:
Tue Jan 12, 2021 1:01 pm

oh noooooooo!!! so its official. that 'first gundam' related project is dead? ok well it was a nice dream. I'll forget it and just be thankful for the new Hathaway trilogy coming
It's official that Yasuhiko announced that his work as a director will not continue into the "main plot" of GTO.(meaning the parts where overlaps with first Gundam and his proposal of doing that part was cancelled, which is related to an earlier tweet he said about he proposed to continue producing the rest of GTO after the prequel parts.

No body said anything about whether that is the first Gundam related project they were talking about or not.
i wish someone here could 'find' those tweets and the date. because Yasuhiko said alot of things. first i do remember him saying in 2017 that he's 'open to remaking the series' when someone asked if he's open to 'continuing' the origin plot.

then in 2018 he claims he would 'retire' after gundam origin ends.

then almost a month after G40 debuts in 2020. he claims he wants to work 'atleast 5 more years' - and he's working something related to the first gundam but he can't say anything about it right now.

so too much mystery. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by MythSearcher » Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:58 pm

bhayes82 wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 3:21 pm
i wish someone here could 'find' those tweets and the date. because Yasuhiko said alot of things. first i do remember him saying in 2017 that he's 'open to remaking the series' when someone asked if he's open to 'continuing' the origin plot.

then in 2018 he claims he would 'retire' after gundam origin ends.

then almost a month after G40 debuts in 2020. he claims he wants to work 'atleast 5 more years' - and he's working something related to the first gundam but he can't say anything about it right now.

so too much mystery. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.
Here's the problem, he opened a new office twitter account called Yasuhiko Yoshigazu Lab early 2020, that is not updated by him, and the original personal account is likely not named after a name directly related to him and at least I cannot find it.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by bhayes82 » Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:49 pm

MythSearcher wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:58 pm
bhayes82 wrote:
Wed Jan 13, 2021 3:21 pm
i wish someone here could 'find' those tweets and the date. because Yasuhiko said alot of things. first i do remember him saying in 2017 that he's 'open to remaking the series' when someone asked if he's open to 'continuing' the origin plot.

then in 2018 he claims he would 'retire' after gundam origin ends.

then almost a month after G40 debuts in 2020. he claims he wants to work 'atleast 5 more years' - and he's working something related to the first gundam but he can't say anything about it right now.

so too much mystery. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.
Here's the problem, he opened a new office twitter account called Yasuhiko Yoshigazu Lab early 2020, that is not updated by him, and the original personal account is likely not named after a name directly related to him and at least I cannot find it.
ok so when an 'official' statement goes out. I'll believe what your saying. beyond that i won't believe anything is cancelled

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by Chris » Fri Jan 15, 2021 10:26 am

bhayes82 wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:49 pm
ok so when an 'official' statement goes out. I'll believe what your saying. beyond that i won't believe anything is cancelled
If the proposal was rejected and no series was greenlit or announced for production, what "statement" are you waiting for, exactly?

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by bhayes82 » Sat Jan 16, 2021 1:00 am

Chris wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 10:26 am
bhayes82 wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:49 pm
ok so when an 'official' statement goes out. I'll believe what your saying. beyond that i won't believe anything is cancelled
If the proposal was rejected and no series was greenlit or announced for production, what "statement" are you waiting for, exactly?
my point I'm making is where is this official statement that the proposal was rejected? a random tweet that no one can find in some forum that no one has heard of from a random Twitter account for the character designer that no one can find. I'm supposed to trust that? Why wasn't it reported on officially? just as his statement that he is working on something related to the 'first gundam' and he can't talk about right now.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by MythSearcher » Sat Jan 16, 2021 5:31 am

bhayes82 wrote:
Sat Jan 16, 2021 1:00 am
my point I'm making is where is this official statement that the proposal was rejected? a random tweet that no one can find in some forum that no one has heard of from a random Twitter account for the character designer that no one can find. I'm supposed to trust that? Why wasn't it reported on officially? just as his statement that he is working on something related to the 'first gundam' and he can't talk about right now.
But you kinda believed that he even proposed that he will continue to make GTO main parts with the same dubious claims of it being rumoured.

You see, the first post you asked for sources I was talking about is this being cancelled, which, is pretty obvious because they didn't continue to release more of GTO after the last episode, with no announcement of they will continue making it at all.
So I don't really need sources to back this up as you don't really get a source stating they are making GTO into the main plot anyway because you are talking about rumours anyway.

Look, there are two things ongoing here: "adapting more GTO" and "Something related to the first series".
What I am talking is the GTO part, not the sourced "First series" part.
Things are pretty clear for GTO, because they didn't do anything, that is the best source you will get. Will this be changed? Maybe, but like I said, if both Yasuhiko and Tomino are involved in a project, it is less likely to be GTO.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by Chris » Sat Jan 16, 2021 11:23 pm

bhayes82 wrote:
Sat Jan 16, 2021 1:00 am
my point I'm making is where is this official statement that the proposal was rejected? a random tweet that no one can find in some forum that no one has heard of from a random Twitter account for the character designer that no one can find. I'm supposed to trust that? Why wasn't it reported on officially? just as his statement that he is working on something related to the 'first gundam' and he can't talk about right now.
In addition to what MythSearcher said, there's lot of things that are worked on and never announced, and then for whatever reason don't come to fruition. We don't always hear about these things that never come to fruition, so why are you expecting an official announcement? Also, the anime industry is much more opaque than Western production companies, so in many cases you never get straight answers for why something does or doesn't happen. Six years ago, the TV series Gargantia was supposed to receive a second season, and then it was suddenly canceled, with "various circumstances" given as the only explanation. All this time later, we still don't know what "various circumstances" means.

What it sounds like here is that you really just want a continuation of Origin to happen and are clinging to the lack of a formal announcement as a reason to say it could still happen. If that's the case, you're going to be waiting a long time for nothing.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by bhayes82 » Sun Jan 17, 2021 8:34 pm

let's wait and see then. after the Hathaway trilogy is done. let's see what they do. if we get to 2024/2025 and more AU Gundam shows have arrived and there's no sign of an Origin continuation insight then you'll BOTH be right. but if I'm right and they do what i think they're doing (rebooting the franchise for a new generation). i WILL make it a point to come back here, resurrect this exact thread and address BOTH of you.

Sure, I'll bet the Covid-19 thing delayed alot of stuff. Hathaway should've came out already. but i still think it's odd that Yoshikazu did that reveal last year (Feb 2020) that he's working on something related to 'first Gundam' but he can't reveal anything right now and wanting to work 5 more years on anime and this announcement came one month after the release of the g40 anime short (Jan 2020) and just 2 years after announcing his retirement after Origin (May 2018) and 3 years prior to announcing that he's open to remaking the old series (Aug 2017). who knows. he and the team that worked on Origin could be working on this so-called 'first gundam' project right now and we wouldn't even know or they might not be at all. let's wait and see what they do and lets see what Yoshikazu puts out.

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Re: do the U.C. Gundam OAV's create continuity problems with the First Series?

Post by MythSearcher » Sun Jan 17, 2021 9:11 pm

bhayes82 wrote:
Sun Jan 17, 2021 8:34 pm
let's wait and see then. after the Hathaway trilogy is done. let's see what they do. if we get to 2024/2025 and more AU Gundam shows have arrived and there's no sign of an Origin continuation insight then you'll BOTH be right. but if I'm right and they do what i think they're doing (rebooting the franchise for a new generation). i WILL make it a point to come back here, resurrect this exact thread and address BOTH of you.

Sure, I'll bet the Covid-19 thing delayed alot of stuff. Hathaway should've came out already. but i still think it's odd that Yoshikazu did that reveal last year (Feb 2020) that he's working on something related to 'first Gundam' but he can't reveal anything right now and wanting to work 5 more years on anime and this announcement came one month after the release of the g40 anime short (Jan 2020) and just 2 years after announcing his retirement after Origin (May 2018) and 3 years prior to announcing that he's open to remaking the old series (Aug 2017). who knows. he and the team that worked on Origin could be working on this so-called 'first gundam' project right now and we wouldn't even know or they might not be at all. let's wait and see what they do and lets see what Yoshikazu puts out.
https://twitter.com/Char_Tweet/status/1 ... 7778671616

Here is a pretty reliable source quoting a pretty recent talk show interview of Yasuhiko.(2021/01/14) You can check the talk show yourself(also linked in a retweet in that account).
安彦 まだ実はアニメをやってます。ガンダムのエピソードのひとつです。これが最後のアニメ作品です。春ぐらいには発表できるかな。
Yasuhiko is still doing animation, for an episode for Gundam. This will be the last anime work. Probably announcement in Spring?

Summarized:
THE ORIGIN 一年戦争編のアニメ化は頓挫したので違う。
Since the animation for The Origin OYW has failed, it is some other thing.
ガンダムのエピソードのひとつ。
One episode of Gundam.

You can likely also find the previous "dubious" tweets I talked about in this account, it's just that twitter aren't really that user friendly for finding particular tweets, so I don't want to go looking for a year's worth of tweets and retweets. But fortunately this most recent interview should answer most of your questions.

So, unless you can fit everything of first Gundam into 1 episode, no, what he is working on aren't a reboot AND since it will be his last anime work, your chances are slim.
You may want to hope that he is the Hayao Miyazaki type of person who keeps coming back despite numerous retirement annoucements. But Yasuhiko's track record puts him in the manga business more than the anime business, and he is still working on manga right now.
You can keep your hopes up, I won't.
Last edited by MythSearcher on Sun Jan 17, 2021 11:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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