How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

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bhayes82
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How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by bhayes82 » Mon Jun 01, 2020 8:08 pm

Gundam Unicorn, Origin, Thunderbolt, Narrative, and now Hathaway show that the U.C. timeline can be given a 'fresh' look to appeal to old fans and new fans. but most of these stories are based on Manga or Novels.

Eventually, there will be no more novels or mangas to adapt. is it possible to continue to add new stories to the universal timeline, but? should they eventually leave it alone?

i mean after Hathaway. Sentinel or Crossbone Gundam are good potential candidates for getting an adaptation.

i still feel that both Thunderbolt and Narrative ended with cliff-hangers could be continued with something new and original

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by MythSearcher » Tue Jun 02, 2020 12:08 am

Virtually unlimited.

You may have no idea how many manga stories are out there, and how many are added these recent years.
From the complete non-canon with strange and purely absurd things like Blaster Mari, Gundam vs Ideon and G no Kakenin (If ANYONE wants to argue the canonity of these, feel free, I just highly doubt your mentality if you do so if you have actually read the thing, and yes, these are all UC) and completely reasonable and conspiracy-ish Gihren assassination plan(again, read the manga until the end and don't try to argue the canonity of this unless you want to claim it is a canon 0090 movie), to the likely canon MSV-R series, you get things that can line up around at least 3 digit hours if adapted.(not that all of them will be interesting or entertaining) Of all these, Sentinel is one of the less likely candidates because of copyright issues and also likely the lack of female characters.(for all sort of reasons, 0083 is a loose/spiritual adaptation of Sentinel)

While you are animating all of these, you will see more novel and manga published.(many likely will be completely failures even before they animate them) Simply put, as long as someone with the money is willing to pay for the animation, meaning the series is still popular enough, novel and manga, which are much cheaper alternatives than anime, will be created to support the franchise.

And then there are the games, all the IF stories of the games, you already get manga adaptations for some.

I personally would like to see the animation of the Ark Performance stories (Gihren assassination plan, MSV-R Johnny Ridden's return) and the trilogy Zephyr, Moon Crisis and REON but that's just me.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by Kuruni » Tue Jun 02, 2020 12:49 am

MythSearcher wrote:
Tue Jun 02, 2020 12:08 am
(If ANYONE wants to argue the canonity of these, feel free, I just highly doubt your mentality if you do so if you have actually read the thing, and yes, these are all UC)
AFAIK, it's also the grandfather of AU. Imagawa read the manga to get in mindset when he has to scrap the original space opera idea for G Gundam.

I mean, it has an old man catching beam saber with bare hands. It's so awesome that nobody care if it's UC or not afterward.
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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by yazi88 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 1:46 am

Gundam Sentinel, like Crossbone, is also very overrated and hyped to death. The actual plot and characters is pretty flat and boring. It was probably the 1st ZZ Sidestory and it has some interesting settings, but it doesn't really go anywhere in the end nor leave much of a impact. The designs are great however, although I wonder why many people praising Sentinel have actually read it and more likely most of them want to see it animated just for the mobile suits alone.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by MythSearcher » Tue Jun 02, 2020 2:31 am

yazi88 wrote:
Tue Jun 02, 2020 1:46 am
Gundam Sentinel, like Crossbone, is also very overrated and hyped to death. The actual plot and characters is pretty flat and boring. It was probably the 1st ZZ Sidestory and it has some interesting settings, but it doesn't really go anywhere in the end nor leave much of a impact. The designs are great however, although I wonder why many people praising Sentinel have actually read it and more likely most of them want to see it animated just for the mobile suits alone.
Most Gundam shows gained their popularity by the coolness of MS[citation needed]

Sentinel specifically is praised for mimicking a realistic military report, not the characters.
The characters, especially the New De-sides are a very weak and loose but thinly disguised Shinsengumi.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by bhayes82 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 7:46 am

What exactly is the copyright problem with Sentinel? the ms suit design is owned by someone else other than sunrise and therefore SUnrise would need to break bread with that party?

i think their idea of crossbone (a sequel to F91) is a good concept but the story, characters and some of the designs need revamping.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by DragoMaster009 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 12:48 pm

I think there should be an interquel between F91 and Crossbone to explain some things, not to mention tie up a couple loose ends from the F91 side, not to mention a F91 show to gain the full story instead of that compressed film.

Say yazi88, what makes Crossbone "very overrated and hyped to death" in your opinion?

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by bhayes82 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 1:18 pm

DragoMaster009 wrote:
Tue Jun 02, 2020 12:48 pm
I think there should be an interquel between F91 and Crossbone to explain some things, not to mention tie up a couple loose ends from the F91 side, not to mention a F91 show to gain the full story instead of that compressed film.

Say yazi88, what makes Crossbone "very overrated and hyped to death" in your opinion?
the idea of crossbone gundam is a good idea but I think yes. the story needs an upgrade and an in between story is necessary. i say take the basic premise of (cecily and seabook take over crossbone vanguard. the crossbone become good guys. cecily and seabook mentor 'new' heroes to fight a new nemesis.) - and start fresh.

because the old manga of crossbone gundam wouldn't translate well in anime form. and there so much left unexplained like what happened to all of the F91 characters?

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by Mafty » Tue Jun 02, 2020 2:54 pm

Agreed If Crossbone was a full length series that could easily help explain a lot of the loose ends in that particular series. even more so it could expand on the back stories of the Jupiter Empire and Zanscare(their connection was kinda vague in Victory).Plus there apparently was an idea for a Victory sequel that had something to do with planetary colony rebellion, but Victory's poor ratings ended that.

As for Sentinel it seems to be a copyright issue between Bandai(Who own the Trademark to Gundam in general) and Model Graphix: who made the story after Bandai left, and thus own the characters and mecha.(Granted this info came from the Gundam wiki so make of it what you will).

Also what does everyone think of adapting late UC works like Gaia Gear? i know that G-Saviour is supposed to push that out of continuity. But Sunrise dislikes G-Saviour, and nothing stopping them from simply putting it further into the timeline.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by Chris » Tue Jun 02, 2020 3:02 pm

Mafty wrote:
Tue Jun 02, 2020 2:54 pm
Also what does everyone think of adapting late UC works like Gaia Gear? i know that G-Saviour is supposed to push that out of continuity. But Sunrise dislikes G-Saviour, and nothing stopping them from simply putting it further into the timeline.
Gaia Gear was already superseded by Tomino's own late UC productions, F91 and V. Also, "Sunrise dislikes G-Saviour" is a completely nonsensical statement with no validity.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by yazi88 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 4:30 pm

DragoMaster009 wrote:
Tue Jun 02, 2020 12:48 pm
I think there should be an interquel between F91 and Crossbone to explain some things, not to mention tie up a couple loose ends from the F91 side, not to mention a F91 show to gain the full story instead of that compressed film.

Say yazi88, what makes Crossbone "very overrated and hyped to death" in your opinion?
The plot in Crossbone is alright its not anything special, but a lot of people hype it up like its a mix of Harlock and Gundam. Visually the art is pretty bad because Hasegawa, the artist (and author of all Crossbone after the 1st series) is a bad artist. Crossbone is not a substitute for F91 cancelled show as few things are even mentioned aside from some mentioned moments. Its also similar in the case of Sentinel that people really like the designs cause its mostly the Gundams here, cause most of the Jupiter Empire units are among the ugliest units, although they could be cleaned up if adapted.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by bhayes82 » Tue Jun 02, 2020 8:13 pm

agreed. i say if there was a true crossbone gundam adaptation. i would start fresh with a new story and just borrow certain elements from the manga - keep the Gundam Designs and the basic premise of Seabook and Ceceily take over the crosbone vanguard army form peace with the federation to stop the Jupiter Empire. and just do something fresh.

that could work in my view. maybe even start are new Manga and leave behind the old one.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by MythSearcher » Wed Jun 03, 2020 12:11 am

bhayes82 wrote:
Tue Jun 02, 2020 7:46 am
What exactly is the copyright problem with Sentinel? the ms suit design is owned by someone else other than sunrise and therefore SUnrise would need to break bread with that party?
Not just the MS design. The story is also owned by 大日本絵画(The company that publishes Model Graphix). Basically creating anything Sentinel means breaking bread with them. It is not completely undoable, as we can see at least Bandai is willing to make models of S Gundam Z Plus and FAZZ(Likely because those are created when Bandai was more involved in the Sentinel project and can claim a bigger part) but creating new items based on these like the Delta plus and Silver Bullet which likely doesn't need to acknowledge 大日本絵画 at all is much more profitable.

BTW, copyright of Gundam isn't owned by Sunrise, all of them are owned by Sotsu co. where Bandai has 100% holdings since 2020/3/1. Sunrise wasnt the only one claiming the copyright to anime like Gundam, Nagoya TV and likely Clover along some others all claimed the copyright to various shows even before Gundam and Sotsu entered as a copyright management company to resolve the issue at the time.
yazi88 wrote:
Tue Jun 02, 2020 4:30 pm
The plot in Crossbone is alright its not anything special, but a lot of people hype it up like its a mix of Harlock and Gundam. Visually the art is pretty bad because Hasegawa, the artist (and author of all Crossbone after the 1st series) is a bad artist. Crossbone is not a substitute for F91 cancelled show as few things are even mentioned aside from some mentioned moments. Its also similar in the case of Sentinel that people really like the designs cause its mostly the Gundams here, cause most of the Jupiter Empire units are among the ugliest units, although they could be cleaned up if adapted.
Sigh, Hasegawa's art isn't bad, just that the style isn't the currently popular shounen style.
That style was popular in the 80s, and while it may not be top grade, at least it is consistent.

Hasegawa's problem is like many other manga/novel stories of Gundam, it goes out of hand without a team behind the production as a limiter, he added way too many personal style into the story which doesn't fit well with the main UC world view. His own SF manga included a lot of other ideas like Star powered ships, silican based life forms, neutron star systems as a prison to prevent warping out etc. is a good reflection of him loving to add whatever he likes in his stories. (That is also why we get Gundam VS Ideon)
Last edited by MythSearcher on Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by Kuruni » Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:10 am

Well, my first impression with Hasegawa is his magnum opus, MAPS. So I get used to his style.

And despite how I jokes that he could change the title of Crossbone to The Braves Pirate (with Gundam's face open to reveal human face), at least many of his MS designs are imaginative.
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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by yazi88 » Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:45 am

Crossbone Steel 7 was a alright story, but Ghost and Dust plot is pretty convoluted and bad like latter Astray stories, the more it goes on the worse it gets.

It seemed for a long time that Hasegawa was the only one doing late UC manga, thankfully there is a ongoing new F90 manga called Fastest Formula. It also tries to connect the gap between Unicorn and F91 era, similar to the novel of Twilight Axis, but is going a bit further from what I've seen of it. It also takes place after F90 series and also has the protagonist from the F91 Formula Wars game, Bergh Scred, as a supporting character. He is pretty obscure too, barely even in much video games outside the F91 Formula Wars game on the Super Famicom.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by MythSearcher » Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:13 am

yazi88 wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 2:45 am
Crossbone Steel 7 was a alright story, but Ghost and Dust plot is pretty convoluted and bad like latter Astray stories, the more it goes on the worse it gets.
This is why they need a production team to oversee the story so that the mangaka won't just make their own characters the most powerful person/mecha in the world. Usually this is done by the responsible editor for other manga, but in Gundam it seems like a lot of these stories goes completely unchecked, and only the ones that is a collaboration is more in line with the world view. E.g. Ecole du Ciel may not be a great story, but at least things don't seem out of place. The Ark Performance stories are also good examples, they might have gone a bit overboard in MSV-R, but isn't to the level of TB, Astray sentai, AOZ, CB Ghost 00I/N, etc.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by DragoMaster009 » Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:34 pm

What do you think the chances of getting an expanded F91 story are?

EDIT:

This maybe a stupid question, but what's wrong with G no Kakenin?

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by MythSearcher » Thu Jun 04, 2020 10:51 pm

DragoMaster009 wrote:
Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:34 pm


This maybe a stupid question, but what's wrong with G no Kakenin?
Nothing's wrong, it just cannot fit into the UC universe and is a completely different type of story.
It uses the mecha in UC(from 0079 to 0093, or MSG to CCA), but the mecha is more like SD Gundam stories and seems to be operating on their own mind. You get something like a ninja+samurai type of story, just in space.
If this is canon, nothing else is, or you might as well claim the SD Gundam series canon to UC.(The SD Gundam series has a plot where some of them travelled to the parallel universe in which they witnessed the UC OYW, so I guess they are clear that the SD Gundam isn't in the same universe, but you get the idea.)

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by yazi88 » Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:21 pm

I just think of it as a spin off manga with no real relations to other universes stores, like Gundam EXA. I haven't read it myself but I don't treat it any different than a SD Gundam story. Sometimes they can be interesting or just fun to read.

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Re: How many more 'new' U.C. stories can be told in anime form?

Post by MythSearcher » Fri Jun 05, 2020 3:00 am

yazi88 wrote:
Thu Jun 04, 2020 11:21 pm
I just think of it as a spin off manga with no real relations to other universes stores, like Gundam EXA. I haven't read it myself but I don't treat it any different than a SD Gundam story. Sometimes they can be interesting or just fun to read.
I like how it is somehow presented in a style resembling inkwash paintings.

It is better than EXA in my opinion. Not a must read but quite unique in the Gundam franchise.

It is fun because it draws a straight face while bascially is making fun of everything. If it is a stand alone manga, its story telling is kinda serious, and nothing of it is comedy if you have no idea the characters are from Gundam, yet you will have no idea what they are talking about because there's too much Gundam related terms(actually, even if you know the terms, some of those are still gibblish). With the knowledge of Gundam though, the serious tone of it just becomes the core of its comedy.

SD Gundam is a comedy without any disguise, so it lacks that kind of twist.
Blaster Mari is similar, slap stick comedy with little disguise, just like Gundam-san and Tony Takezaki no Gundam, all are not quite my type of read.(excluding SD Gundam, somehow that isn't as bad as these, but comedy is very subjective)

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