The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

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BrentD15
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by BrentD15 » Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:58 am

monster wrote:
BrentD15 wrote:And at least Tomino acknowledges the flaws in his series (unlike some other directors, i.e. Fukuda).
I thought I read somewhere that Fukuda wasn't too pleased with GSD either. Then again, it was decently successful, so there's that.
One can only imagine what he meant by that (especially since his own wife was the head writer, and I doubt he would've said anything negative about her online). :P
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Brave Fencer Kirby » Sun Apr 26, 2015 9:08 am

Speaking as someone who's only partway through the series (I've been watching it as it goes up on Youtube, so I'm up through episode 9), it definitely feels incoherent to me. Bellri, in particular, seems to do things based on what the plot requires of him, rather than doing things out of any internally-consistent motivation. He seems to be a loyal Capital Guard cadet, but then happily helps a POW escape and then joins up with her "space pirate" crew (ostensibly to gather intelligence on them, but he completely fails to even attempt to get any sort of message back to the Capital Tower, except for one time early on when he goes "oh yeah, Minovsky particles, whoops" and then drops the whole thing), sticks around even when it turns out they're Amerian military, and happily fights against -- and shoots down and kills -- Capital Army units without batting an eye. I realize that the Capital Guard and the Capital Army don't exactly see eye to eye, but there's an enormous difference between opposing an allied faction politically and being okay with killing them.

Basically, Bellri seems to have defected to the Megafauna without noticing, because the narrative takes great pains to avoid the fact that his stated goals and his actual actions are completely at odds, as the plot would fall apart if it did. The story requires Bellri to be part of the Megafauna crew, so that happens, regardless of the fact that it doesn't actually make much sense. Is that an issue that could've been fixed with a longer-running series that had more screentime to devote to it? Maybe, but I have doubts. It doesn't seem like a pacing problem to me. It's not that the characters aren't fully developed, it's that their development doesn't match their actions. Devoting more time to that isn't going to make the dissonance go away.
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by latenlazy » Sun Apr 26, 2015 1:05 pm

Brave Fencer Kirby wrote:Speaking as someone who's only partway through the series (I've been watching it as it goes up on Youtube, so I'm up through episode 9), it definitely feels incoherent to me. Bellri, in particular, seems to do things based on what the plot requires of him, rather than doing things out of any internally-consistent motivation. He seems to be a loyal Capital Guard cadet, but then happily helps a POW escape and then joins up with her "space pirate" crew (ostensibly to gather intelligence on them, but he completely fails to even attempt to get any sort of message back to the Capital Tower, except for one time early on when he goes "oh yeah, Minovsky particles, whoops" and then drops the whole thing), sticks around even when it turns out they're Amerian military, and happily fights against -- and shoots down and kills -- Capital Army units without batting an eye. I realize that the Capital Guard and the Capital Army don't exactly see eye to eye, but there's an enormous difference between opposing an allied faction politically and being okay with killing them.

Basically, Bellri seems to have defected to the Megafauna without noticing, because the narrative takes great pains to avoid the fact that his stated goals and his actual actions are completely at odds, as the plot would fall apart if it did. The story requires Bellri to be part of the Megafauna crew, so that happens, regardless of the fact that it doesn't actually make much sense. Is that an issue that could've been fixed with a longer-running series that had more screentime to devote to it? Maybe, but I have doubts. It doesn't seem like a pacing problem to me. It's not that the characters aren't fully developed, it's that their development doesn't match their actions. Devoting more time to that isn't going to make the dissonance go away.
Bellri's motivations get fleshed out more in the episode where he uses the Reflector Pack.

EDIT: Reread your post and you might be there already. The only other thing I can add is to keep in mind the Capital Tower is actually not in conflict with any of the other factions in the world, so in a sense Bellri isn't really parlaying with a group that's he sees as an enemy. As for the effectiveness of his intelligence operation...well, he was probably in over his head anyways, and got carried away. If you're at the episode where he uses the Reflector pack, he has a small moment where he realizes this. For what it's worth, I do think getting carried away is part of Bellri's boyish nature but YMMV.

As the series goes on you realize that some of the conflict norms are different in RC, but those different conflict norms manifest the most within the Capital Tower and the Capital Guard. The Capital Army is far more sinister, and Bellri's less ambivalent attitude towards fighting with them may stem from that kind of impression.

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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Brave Fencer Kirby » Sun Apr 26, 2015 5:27 pm

Any question of whether or not he "really" joined them or they were "really" fighting went out the door the minute he started killing Capital Tower forces, in my view. Yeah, he's been fighting Capital Army mooks rather than his friends in the Capital Guard (except that some of the latter joined the former, which he's been aware of since his encounter with Dellensen in like episode 4), but it hasn't really been shown that there's that much of a rift between the two that Bell is comfortable fighting and killing them without a second though. (Then again, his angst when he inevitably ends up killing someone he cares about lasts for all of about 30 seconds, so maybe he's just a little bastard.)

The reflector pack I've seen already, yeah -- he used it in episode 7ish during the brief trip to space. I don't recall any particular illuminations on his motivation from that episode, though.

The whole "he did something stupid and got in over his head" I can buy, it's just that that's not really how the show presents the situation. What it reminds me of most is Judau semi-voluntarily joining the Argama's crew at the beginning of ZZ, due to a combination of happenstance and "eh, why not, not like I've got anything better to do anyway". Except that unlike Judau, Bellri definitely does have better things to be doing, he just shows no actual interest in doing them.
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Kuruni » Sun Apr 26, 2015 11:29 pm

BrentD15 wrote:
monster wrote:
BrentD15 wrote:And at least Tomino acknowledges the flaws in his series (unlike some other directors, i.e. Fukuda).
I thought I read somewhere that Fukuda wasn't too pleased with GSD either. Then again, it was decently successful, so there's that.
One can only imagine what he meant by that (especially since his own wife was the head writer, and I doubt he would've said anything negative about her online). :P
He wasn't too please because he think Kira & co should have even more flawless victory. :mrgreen:

Back to G-reco, my impression is that Bellri at first want to play hero (to impress his mom, maybe?) by play prisoner, confirm that the pirates are really Ameria force, take note of their violation of SU-cordism taboo, then escape and report back to Capital Guard. As well as payback to Aida for killing Kahill, for he's clearly attach to her. Thing is that once he kill Dellensen (when he suppose to make the escape), he's kind of realize he has gone too far and lets it be (not a good kind of thinking, but it happen in real life).
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Amion » Tue Apr 28, 2015 7:23 pm

I also thought that it did have to do with the Capital Army a bit. He seemed somewhat disconcerted by their existence. I know it may not seem like much difference for us, but from someone who's a Su-Cordist the difference is very plain: they have GM evolutions while the guard just has the the... whatever the Su-cord those Rectin things are supposed to be.
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by latenlazy » Tue Apr 28, 2015 9:05 pm

That almost antagonistic suspicion and division is seen more clearly in later episodes, including with how the CG and Kerbes treat the Megafauna compared to the CA, so Bellri's opposition to the CA and willingness to fight them isn't an isolated thing. The Capital Tower is not really a country, and so the ties that bind the Capital Guard and Capital army are not national but factional. We actually see this factional antagonism between armies representative of state entities mirrored in other places in RC, including Towasanga and Venus Globe. This is another instance where the social and political context in RC is different from contemporary society so we have to rethink basic assumptions about how different individuals and groups relate to each other politically to make sense of the story.

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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Mythgarr » Wed Apr 29, 2015 3:02 am

Wow, you guys are still talking about G-Reco? Tomino must be proud!
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by BrentD15 » Wed Apr 29, 2015 7:07 am

Mythgarr wrote:Wow, you guys are still talking about G-Reco? Tomino must be proud!
Why shouldn't we? :)
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Kuruni » Wed Apr 29, 2015 11:03 pm

Well, keep in mind that Gundam Info channel only release 9 episodes at this point. So some of us are actually in the middle of it.
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Amion » Thu Apr 30, 2015 1:22 pm

Were we supposed to treat it like Gundam AGE and forget it exists? :P
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by HalfDemonInuyasha » Thu Apr 30, 2015 3:31 pm

Amion wrote:Were we supposed to treat it like Gundam AGE and forget it exists? :P
At least 1/3 of AGE. The first 2/3 weren't THAT bad, IMO.
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Amion » Thu Apr 30, 2015 5:58 pm

HalfDemonInuyasha wrote:
Amion wrote:Were we supposed to treat it like Gundam AGE and forget it exists? :P
At least 1/3 of AGE. The first 2/3 weren't THAT bad, IMO.
*Hands over a chocolate bar*
Thanks, I'm glad I'm not the only one in this universe who actually enjoyed AGE for the most part. Its story premise had real potential I believe...
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by latenlazy » Thu Apr 30, 2015 6:22 pm

Amion wrote:
HalfDemonInuyasha wrote:
Amion wrote:Were we supposed to treat it like Gundam AGE and forget it exists? :P
At least 1/3 of AGE. The first 2/3 weren't THAT bad, IMO.
*Hands over a chocolate bar*
Thanks, I'm glad I'm not the only one in this universe who actually enjoyed AGE for the most part. Its story premise had real potential I believe...
Part 1 was surprisingly good. Part 2 had both good and facepalm inducing moments. Part 3 was mostly just the latter.

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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by BrentD15 » Thu Apr 30, 2015 6:45 pm

latenlazy wrote:
Amion wrote:*Hands over a chocolate bar*
Thanks, I'm glad I'm not the only one in this universe who actually enjoyed AGE for the most part. Its story premise had real potential I believe...
Part 1 was surprisingly good. Part 2 had both good and facepalm inducing moments. Part 3 was mostly just the latter.
I'm willing to forgive AGE for it's faults because it was Akihiro's first time writing an anime, and I'm hoping he gained some experience about how to properly pace it.
"To you who will watch, I offer a heart filled with gratitude." -Yoshiyuki Tomino, Gundam Reconguista in G, Episode 25

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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by latenlazy » Thu Apr 30, 2015 6:47 pm

BrentD15 wrote:
latenlazy wrote:
Amion wrote:*Hands over a chocolate bar*
Thanks, I'm glad I'm not the only one in this universe who actually enjoyed AGE for the most part. Its story premise had real potential I believe...
Part 1 was surprisingly good. Part 2 had both good and facepalm inducing moments. Part 3 was mostly just the latter.
I'm willing to forgive AGE for it's faults because it was Akihiro's first time writing an anime, and I'm hoping he gained some experience about how to properly pace it.
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Chris » Fri May 01, 2015 8:59 am

Ok, that's enough AGE diversion. Let's please stick to G-Reco.

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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Mythgarr » Thu May 07, 2015 1:20 am

I want season 2. At least a prequel to what happens in G-Reco. A history of Towasanga perhaps? The Construction of Venus Globe?
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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Wellman » Fri May 08, 2015 1:06 am

Mythgarr wrote:I want season 2. At least a prequel to what happens in G-Reco. A history of Towasanga perhaps? The Construction of Venus Globe?

ME, I just want more scenes of G-Self dominated in the perfect backpack.

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Re: The Official Gundam Reconguista Anime Thread Mk III

Post by iguanaman8989 » Sat May 16, 2015 9:03 pm

Huh. No update yet this week, plus they seem to have revoked US viewing capability on all the previous episodes. (GundamInfo on YouTube)

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