Cross Ange

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Iris Scope
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Iris Scope » Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:24 pm

The 2nd ED song sounded like it was recycling bits and pieces of the 1st OP song which makes it feel like a poor effort.

Hilda taking a bullet meant for Chris was redeeming of her character and it shows in how Chris and Rosalie treat her better for what remains of the episode. I'm starting to think that unless Salia stops being bitter about Ange being the chosen one, she's going to end up dying with no one to care about it.

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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Erisie » Sun Jan 04, 2015 3:05 pm

I agree with Destiny_Gundam's sentiment exactly. This episode was very End of Evangelion, with some elements of the various seaborne battles of SEED/Destiny added for good measure. Definitely the most Fukuda episode thus far, for better or worse.

The way things are right now, it appears that we've got a number of competing schemes/plotlines: Alektra's Libertus (of which Salia is a blind follower), the humans' "reset" and whatever the heck are Sala and/or Embryo about.

Those two Mail-Riders (?) that appear next to Sala seem like they escaped from a Nagano series.

Also, I was right on the money about Chris all this time! I told you, guys!
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...except for all that thing with Embryo bringing people back to life
2nd OP song sucks compared to the first though. Unless they flipped the script as anime will sometimes do and will be giving Nana's ED song the OP spot after this episode.
My thoughts exactly. I would accept the new song as an insert or an ED, but it doesn't work at all as an OP. I got vibes to "Wings of Words", although this is not that awful.
It doesn't help either that the new OP animation recycles 80% of its footage from the previous one, making the dissonance more jarring. With a bit of luck, it probably is just a prototype/mock-up for a new OP, like what SAC did back in the day.

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HellCat
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by HellCat » Sun Jan 04, 2015 3:33 pm

OP music doesn't surprise me. Fukuda has always been more about sensationalism rather than true craft and impact. The fact that he continues to think the last leg of stories should just have something wishy washy rather than a piece that makes you think 'this is what it all comes down to' just speaks of what a hack he is.
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Erisie » Sun Jan 04, 2015 4:36 pm

HellCat wrote:Fukuda has always been more about sensationalism rather than true craft and impact. The fact that he continues to think the last leg of stories should just have something wishy washy rather than a piece that makes you think 'this is what it all comes down to' just speaks of what a hack he is.
Oh, I don't deny that. As I've argued before, this thing is not the next LoGH by any measure. Cross Ange is just pure, unhealthy, thrashy fun. Nobody expects something like Pacific Rim or The Avengers to win any awards for their writing.

SEED failed miserably because Fukuda had free reign to do whatever he wanted. From what we know, he's a fan of schlocky 70s super-robot anime that are barely disguised toy commercials, the very paradigm that Tomino tried to move away from when he conceived Mobile Suit Gundam. The end product with SEED was a complete disaster that focused mostly on seeing mecha doing ridiculous poses, with any and all substance being composed of melodramatic back-and-forths between the characters. All of this while having the intent of being "Gundam for the 21st Century".
Since Cross Ange does not have any of such lofty aspirations (nor is, thus far, a mindless cocktail of poorly done ideas like, say, Ichiro Okuichi's masterpieces Valvrave and Guilty Crown), it has room to do its own thing.

It's also a good thing that Fukuda is only the "creative producer" rather than director and there's no Chiaki Morosawa anywhere to be seen.

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Iris Scope
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Iris Scope » Sun Jan 04, 2015 4:42 pm

I was SO glad to see Julio get blown away though not by Ange and by Embryo instead made it seem like a waste of an perfect opportunity for him to truly know what vengeance is. To see even his vampire assistant leave him in the open for blasting time was such poetic justice.

Till the world accepts DRAGONs with open arms, i'll keep my fingers crossed for sweet little Vivian NOT to get whacked since she's such a kawaii DRAGON!

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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by BrentD15 » Sun Jan 04, 2015 8:49 pm

Iris Scope wrote:Till the world accepts DRAGONs with open arms, i'll keep my fingers crossed for sweet little Vivian NOT to get whacked since she's such a kawaii DRAGON!
Indeed.
The little "Shh" thing she does is just cute. :D
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Soma Taozi » Mon Jan 05, 2015 1:28 am

Yep. I don't care anymore. Screw G-Reco and Gundam Build Fighters Try. This is my favorite Sunrise show this season. What a great episode, that really embraces what this series is all about! :)
HellCat wrote:OP music doesn't surprise me. Fukuda has always been more about sensationalism rather than true craft and impact. The fact that he continues to think the last leg of stories should just have something wishy washy rather than a piece that makes you think 'this is what it all comes down to' just speaks of what a hack he is.
I am sorry but...bitter much? Holy crap, everything you post now is such a downer.
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Destiny_Gundam » Mon Jan 05, 2015 1:52 am

"In the end, the world doesn't really need a Superman... Just a brave one."

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wielder
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by wielder » Mon Jan 05, 2015 3:44 am

Remember the saying that if you don't have anything nice to say then it's better to remain silent?

That accurately describes my view of Cross Ange and everything that it represents. To that effect, I tend to feel the expression "pure, unhealthy and trashy" is interchangeable with "mindless cocktail of poorly done ideas" in its essence, making use of Erisie's phrases from a couple of posts ago without further elaboration.

I'm not going to bother or troll those who are still watching and enjoying the show at this point, but I can't help but read Fukuda's words about the OP with a heavy dose of cynicism. That's all I want to comment on.
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HellCat
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by HellCat » Mon Jan 05, 2015 6:25 am

Soma Taozi wrote:Yep. I don't care anymore. Screw G-Reco and Gundam Build Fighters Try. This is my favorite Sunrise show this season. What a great episode, that really embraces what this series is all about! :)
HellCat wrote:OP music doesn't surprise me. Fukuda has always been more about sensationalism rather than true craft and impact. The fact that he continues to think the last leg of stories should just have something wishy washy rather than a piece that makes you think 'this is what it all comes down to' just speaks of what a hack he is.
I am sorry but...bitter much? Holy crap, everything you post now is such a downer.
With Fukuda I'm certainly a cynic.

Apologies, there's no active effort on my part to be negative. Perhaps certain ongoing events have had more of an impact on me then I realised.
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Erisie » Mon Jan 05, 2015 12:45 pm

wielder wrote:To that effect, I tend to feel the expression "pure, unhealthy and trashy" is interchangeable with "mindless cocktail of poorly done ideas" in its essence, making use of Erisie's phrases from a couple of posts ago without further elaboration.
Want elaboration? Fine.

Cross Ange is doing is thing with a limited number of ideas and trying (thus far) to keep focused on the protagonist. From the first episode to the latest one, the characterizations have been consistent: Ange is still a misanthropic impulsive ace, Tusk provides comic relief, Momoka provides Ange with something of a conscience, et cetera.
he show's pacing is good: no episode has been filler, regardless of its silly shenanigans.

In something like Valvrave, you clearly see that there wasn't any clear idea beyond vapourous high-concepts (school setting, space colony, vampires, robots, global war, conspiracies) and a setting populated by high school (protagonist, his childhood friend, his romantic interest, various geeks, school council, clueless teachers) and military (the Dorssia people) stereotypes. Over and over, it attempted to hide its flaws by stretching suspension of disbelief to the point of rupture. It was never clear, at any point, on what it wanted to do or where it wanted to go, making it a confusing trainwreck of an anime series.
As a story, it was a bloated, confusing mess that only served as a jungle juice made with all the succesful ideas that Sunrise had made until that point. It has elements from UC Gundam, SEED, Geass, VOTOMS/Gasaraki, Zegapain, Escaflowne, among others.

This is not the case with Cross Ange. Thus far, the focus is tight on Ange's struggle against a world that antagonizes her from all directions, alongside her duty as whatever is her and Vilkiss' fate.

To close this, there's also one final point to consider: Guilty Crown and Valvrave share more than just Ichiro Okuichi as screenwriter. Both were projects spearheaded by Aniplex (Sony's anime wing) and, as such, bear the scars of "design by committee". Despite all its flaws and the vacuous entertainment it represents, at least Cross Ange is a fully Sunrise project.

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wielder
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by wielder » Mon Jan 05, 2015 2:25 pm

Erisie:

To be absolutely clear, I wasn't actually demanding that you provide said elaboration. Quite the opposite, it was a preemptive acknowledgment that I don't want to talk about this show in great detail, in large part because there is a striking contrast between my negativity and your positivity towards it.

For me, Cross Ange is just as much -if not even more- of a bloated, confusing and derivative mess as the shows you're criticizing, except with additionally repulsive elements that both break my suspension of disbelief and literally reduce my potential interest in the series to zero. That inevitably kneecaps whatever it may allegedly try to do better and makes me look down on the show with contempt for the people responsible. I was willing to give Fukuda and co. a chance, but that train has long since left the station. Better luck next time.

I don't agree with several of your statements and find others to be extremely open to debate or even partially inaccurate (say, Hiroyuki Yoshino wrote the majority of Guilty Crown -not Okouchi- while Tatsuto Higuchi, one of his former collaborators, happens to be involved here as a screenwriter).

Ultimately, I can only hope that you'll continue to find whatever you seek here. For me, there is absolutely nothing to look forward to in this project. I trust we can agree to disagree and move on.

EDITED:

Destiny Gundam,

It's not just that. Different people will react differently to those and other things.
Last edited by wielder on Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Destiny_Gundam » Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:39 pm

wielder wrote:additionally repulsive elements that both break my suspension of disbelief and literally reduce my potential interest in the series to zero.
Wait, are you still hung up on the cavity seach and attempted prison rape from the first two episodes? Dude, that was so long ago and it hasn't really done anything close to that since. Sure, there's plenty of lesbian sex going on, but consentual sex is consentual.
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Henyo » Tue Jan 06, 2015 9:35 am

ah, episode 13. didn't really think of it as a End of EVA like until reading the posts here. i have to agree though. Chris' would be death scene of reminds me yet again of ideon.

embryo is Toshihiko Seki? oh man, i hope we don't get FS/N Gilgamesh singing on the paramail fanart.(maybe some peeps would want Duo Maxwell?)

that last shot of the OP has yuri fans proclaiming that Ange's going for the Yuri Harem route. i wouldn't mind that. still, i support the Ange X Sala Ship.(i'll ready myself for the eventual ship sinking torpedo. Tusk's existence prompts that. :twisted: )
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Destiny_Gundam » Tue Jan 06, 2015 12:48 pm

Gilgamesh is Tomokazu Semi, the guy who was Domon.
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Iris Scope
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Iris Scope » Tue Jan 06, 2015 10:41 pm

If Ange/Tusk doesn't get going and quickly in the time left, I still hold out hope for my desired Ange/Hilda pairing due to the playful banter of "hatred" they spew when *Hilda, at least* CLEARLY they want to shut that light and get close. :mrgreen:

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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Raikoh » Wed Jan 07, 2015 12:59 am

On the subject of the image, I tend to put a decent amount of faith in official art - especially when it's in the OP. I don't remember if I said it here, but I predict Tusk is going to die at some point, also because he didn't appear in the group shot (admittedly said image is a blatant service shot, with Fukuda's main priority on changing the OP being "make them nude").

Of course, that prediction was back in the earlier grimdark episodes.
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Henyo » Wed Jan 07, 2015 9:17 am

Destiny_Gundam wrote:Gilgamesh is Tomokazu Semi, the guy who was Domon.
and here i thought i'd never make that mistake of confusing the Seki Seiyuus. ah well.

Domon parodying Embryo would also be hilarious to see. a Paramail Style Shining/God Gundam please.


if Ange X Sala aint happening i can always go to Ange X Hilda. ah, it's NanoFate mecha pilots version.
on the subject of characters surviving, anyone expecting Vivi to meet the same fate as the majority of Kuwashima's characters? :twisted:
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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by Lord Dearche » Sun Jan 11, 2015 5:55 am

By the looks of it it's definitely heading to Ange and Big Boss afterall. Especially after this weeks episode. Loved they snuck in the face in her crotch gag right at the last second. Sadly by the looks of things, Hilda has probably already been pushed aside to a background character. The show seems to be heading into the territory of anyone who's not piloting one of the Vilkiss type mechs with Surround Sound speakers, will probably be useless in general in the important fights.

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Re: Cross Ange- New Sunrise x Fukuda mecha show

Post by teslashark » Sun Jan 11, 2015 8:59 am

I told you Dragons and Manas are just ridiculously Co-ordinated normal dudes! I told you!
...and Mu La Flaga got a motel named after him, the Mu-A-Ra-Fu-Ra-Ga.
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