The Official Gundam Wing Thread

[Zeino]

Seeing as how Victory and X have talkback threads. I thought it would alright to make one for Wing as well (if Chris and the mods don't mind.) I'm curious to know people 's thoughts about it some 12 years after the show's popularity peak back in 2000 which was before my time as an anime fan. I do know that it used to be the single biggest dividing line in the fandom until the Cosmic Era, 00 and Age came along to replace it as the Gundam series to most argue about. So then how many of you here still enjoy Wing?

[DuelGundam2099]

My gateway to gundam, although I didn't see it until mid 2007.

[Arbiter GUNDAM]

Take a look at my avatar and guess who my favorite Gundam character is.

Seriously, Wing might not be the best or worst of what Gundam has to offer, but it will always be one of my favorites. And also (blasphemy of blasphemies) I think I actually like Zechs a little more than Char himself.

[AmuroNT1]

So then how many of you here still enjoy Wing?

Not me.

</massive sarcasm>

[Amadi Akintunde]

I still enjoy it - I feel it's one of the better AUs that's come out of the franchise, derpy dialogue aside.

I just wish the Wing Gundam was given better screentime. In was incredibly underwhelming to see every time it showed up, and when it wasn't being used, it was under water. I really wish it had taken part in the ruckus of outer space during episodes 17-26.

[LightningCount]

If I recall correctly, while I'd seen pieces of the 0079 Movies, 0080, and 0083, it was Wing that made me a Gundam fan. Still love it to this day, and actually appreciate it more. I've actually started to wear out some of the DVDs for this series (though some of that may have to do with the "claw" in some of Bandai's DVD cases I've sadly had to seal/tape some cracks on the plastic center of a few DVDs).

Anyway, it's one of those series you can pop in an episode and enjoy (as there are some really memorable encounters, scenarios, and duels), or watch the whole thing and go on an incredible journey. In my mind, and I've seen a good majority of Gundam, it's the most "complete" series in terms of the way it vividly balances characters, action, plot twists, politics, philosophy, world depth, mecha, etc. There are series that do one element or another better, but I think Wing gives the strongest sampling of all facets of Gundam (minus Newtypes, I guess...though, ironically, I've never been too big on that).

I think the wounded characters and how they search for their purpose when both their initial missions and the world around them keeps changing, is very compelling and unlike any other Gundam series in the way the pilots are forced into differing, sometimes opposing views. Each character gets their own time to develop outside of the collective of a team or military faction, giving a strangely human look at war from what one would expect to be an inhuman perspective. The Gundams themselves, and their Gundanium armor" are focused on as something special, providing an interesting dichotomy and reason for the series to be called "Gundam." And while it may have its flawed, awkward moments or dialogue, no Gundam series is perfect, and with the latter, I think by going for broke it has some of the most enjoyable, encouraging, and/or insightful exchanges. Without quoting Treize's or Heero's or the others' huge monologues, here are two that get across what I mean:

"When you put everything into a battle, you start to think that you can change the times all by yourself, don’t you? Quatre, you’re not the only one who feels that way. We all do. But the kinder you are, the bigger the toll it takes on you. We have to fight with ourselves, in our hearts, and we have to do it harshly, in order to come to the right conclusions" ~Trowa Barton

"If everything has gone crazy then I'll believe in myself and keep fighting" ~Heero Yuy

It's late, so that's all I've got for now. But needless to say, I've got a lot of positive things to say about Gundam Wing to this day. It's not just a Gundam series, it stands out in the anime pantheon as something that has good reach outside of Gundam or mecha fans, along the lines of something like Cowboy Bebop.

[Amadi Akintunde]

Couldn't agree more there, I think.

[Khandri]

While I've long since branched out into other aspects of the franchise, Gundam Wing was what brought me into Gundam as a whole, and I never looked back after that. Sure, it's a little cheesy now, and it's not aged particularly well in many ways, not to mention that there are far better Gundam series out there, but it still holds a special place in my heart for what it's helped me discover beyond that.

Back when it first came out here in 2000, when I was going on 20 years old and in my second year of college (yeah, I'm old), I still hadn't seen a whole lot of anime yet beyond the sort of things they'd show on TV. But I'd vaguely heard of Gundam in general already, and that it was a big deal in Japan, so when it premiered, I thought I'd give it a look and see what the whole to-do is. And I tell you...despite my being female, it wasn't just the pretty boys that pulled me in. (I honestly couldn't care less about all the shipping and/or yaoi nonsense.) The in-depth storylines and political maneuvering, as well as the pretty, pretty mecha left me constantly wanting more. There was nothing else like it on TV at the time (at least not in a format that made it appealing to me), and the fact that they would air the uncut episodes at night proved this even further, as I was so used to the sanitised, dumbed-down anime of the time. Airing the two versions was quite the gamble on Cartoon Network's part, and it paid off in spades, paving the way for Adult Swim a few years down the road.

How do I see it nowadays? As of right now, probably more with nostalgia than anything else. There are other Gundam series that I like a whole lot more than Wing, but goodness if I didn't get giddy with the April Fool's Day airing of the one episode earlier this year, reminding me of just how much I loved it when it was first on, and how much I miss having something like this on TV again. And I've been doing a slow re-watch of the series lately too, watching it for the first time in Japanese (though I stalled out at about the halfway point about a month or so ago--really ought to get back to it). Like I said...it's not aged well in some respects (the animation in particular), but it's still good fun, and I don't feel at all guilty for enjoying it like I briefly did years ago.

And of course, it has the awesomeness that are the themes by Two-Mix. That was my gateway drug into Japanese music, I tell you.

[LightningCount]

How do I see it nowadays? As of right now, probably more with nostalgia than anything else...Like I said...it's not aged well in some respects (the animation in particular), but it's still good fun, and I don't feel at all guilty for enjoying it like I briefly did years ago.

And of course, it has the awesomeness that are the themes by Two-Mix. That was my gateway drug into Japanese music, I tell you.

On the animation aging, I have mixed thoughts. While on the one sense it has aged visually, it has several things still going for it that say otherwise. One thing is how it presents a sort of near-future, dirty view of space as opposed to the more sterile/hi-tech view we get from Cosmic Era or Gundam 00, and it spends a good amount of time creating a consistency of technology in the frequent looks inside cockpits. That gives the world an "Earthy" texture that matches well with the cel animation. Two is the choreography. While some of it is understandably repeated (in some sections more than others), there is a panache to the movement, camera angles, and scenarios (partially do to a focus on up-close-and-personal MS combat) that makes it more modern than a lot of Gundams. I'm not a "Wing-only" guy--I like a good swathe of Gundam--but Wing really stands out in its dynamic action. It doesn't use a lot of pans or obvious shortcuts (aside from reusing shots, of course). You see a lot of quick and subtle movements, or artsy choices, that really make the Gundams look "mobile" and bring the world to life. It really leans more toward the OVA and movie Gundam animation than the typical TV Gundam. Now, Gundam 00 does certainly have superior moments (largely in Season 1 strangely), but scene for scene, I think Gundam Wing has more memorable choreography. Certainly more than SEED, and that was made long after Wing, and it even has more movement than X. If you look at the mid-90s TV Gundam, the only one that probably does more movement or artsy shots to emphasize the MS than Wing is G-Gundam.

As one example, I'll point Episode 12, where Wufei activates his Gundam to fight off the Bundt/OZ betrayal falling upon Sally's rebel camp:

Wufei begins running toward his Gundam with a monologue, while they simultaneously cut to him having already arrived in his Gundam, where he is priming all its systems--creating a sense of duel momentum. Next, you see a helicopter coming into view with Colonel Bundt gloating, framed by the back of the chair of his OZ co-conspirator. Suddenly, bullet fire races across the moving sky in the helicopter's cockpit window behind Bundt in the background, followed by an explosion and the helicopter's pilot warning Bundt of the Gundam, and Bundt reacting. We switch to a close-up of the Gundam's head vulcans going crazy, showing another helicopter* until it blows up.

The light/lens flare glow from this plays off Wufei's Gundam below, along with the Aries suits he is now set to face. He pulls out his beam glaive in a lumbering manner, and activates his boosters, which tear apart the trees in tune with the booster's output path and dramatically alter the Gundam's speed in contrast with what was seen before. The booster output slows and the Gundam drives its glaive into an Aries in near slow-motion, allowing time to see the melting before the inevitable explosion. Another Aries swoops in and starts firing, its bullets fragmenting off of the Gundamium armor. Wufei turns, the cockpit camera angle actually turning in time with his mecha** to highlight the velocity and he swings his glaive on the Aries.

Cut to a splash of static signifying the interruption of electrical camera feed of the attacking Aries. Followed by a far shot that shows the glaive's beam sliced the Aries (and the action is framed by two dark mountains, highlighting the Gundam between them, as it turns to face more Aries). The Gundam then twirls the beam glaive around its body, the animation slowing to show the torque on the glaive's pole, and slices up two more Aries. The animation slows for effect, showing the detonations of each Aries as we pan toward the beam's slash path. Bundt is now at the front of the helicipter looking out the window with his pilots, and he is terrified.

Wufei makes a movement with his cockpit sticks, and his Gundam boosts up, its dragon hand transforming while the trees dissolve behind it. Wufei's Gundam grabs an Aries with its dragon hand, showing the enemy's battle damage, just before he hurls the detonating Aries right through the helicopter's window, where Bunndt is washed away in an artistic burst of light that warps and then dissolves the lines making up his drawn body. Pan back to show the result, with the Gundam a stalwart black silhouette.

*The incidental machinery in Wing, things like tanks, cars, bikes, planes, shuttles, helicopters, gun turrets, etc, is often more thought out, intricate, and varied than in most Gundam series, which focus more on just the future-tech.

**The way the characters are linked to the Gundams in the movement department and the personal attachment they have for their machines really creates a strong reflection between the mecha and the characters as co-equal narrative devices, creating more interest in the battles.

I also want to add to my earlier post that my favorite Gundam series have a significant emphasis of "on-foot" activities/missions as they do mecha battles. Wing, G, X are generally the kings at understanding this balance that allows the characters to face challenges beyond their mecha.

I really like the music of Wing. The way it mixes rock, techno, orchestra, and even mechanical sounds reflects the AC world's contrasts of high society and high ideals with the struggles of war and the spectacular, even inhuman and eerie advances of technology. Unicorn is one of the more recent series to try this style again with its song, Mobile Suit, to great effect.

[Apsalas]

Tried to re-watch in Japanese + subs a few weeks back....got 3 episodes in....maybe try again next year.

On the plus...Leo and Tallgesse = massive love and hugs....fav suits along with Turn A, Turn X and Sumo.

[schwarz ritter]

I love Gundam Wing. It was my first Gundam, as many people here. The Leos actually looks like battle weapons and not just model kit advertisement dolls. Aside from the bullshit explosions, they seem as real as Unicorn's Lotos.

[Arbiter GUNDAM]

Although one thing I always thought was weird about Wing was that the characters exist in this world of space colonies, mobile suits, interplanetary travel and particle beam weapons, yet more common technology like cars and computers look just like they did back in 1995...

[LightningCount]

Although one thing I always thought was weird about Wing was that the characters exist in this world of space colonies, mobile suits, interplanetary travel and particle beam weapons, yet more common technology like cars and computers look just like they did back in 1995...

It is sort of funny, but it's also kind of cool. It's a world of contradictions, and even in the time we live in, we see various technologies advancing at different rates in comparison to one another, some things behind, some things ahead. That made me connect with After Colony a little more, I think, because for all its fantastic elements it felt more "grounded" and near-future, sort of like Cowboy Bebop's mix of old and new. In a fictional future, there's no rule as to how things "must" evolve, and/or at what rate, allowing for interesting visual contrasts.

EDIT: Adding to that, even though it's a world of mobile suits and colonies and such, there's a sense that they don't take their lifestyles for granted. They're not 100% comfortable with the advances. It doesn't ever seem like people can project just how powerful a mobile suit can be, or just how stable their colony life will be.

[Khandri]

^ I suppose the fact that the tech looks so unabashedly mid-'90s is part of what makes it look so dated to me, but at the same time, it's part of the charm too. Technology is one of those things that's sometimes so hard to predict what it might look like in the future (I'm not sure how many people in 1995 could've predicted current technology like iPods, iPads, or smartphones, for example), so sometimes it's easier to simply fall back on what you know and use that (or something similar to it) instead. I think just about all of the pre-Turn-A series are like that. (And even some of the post-Turn-A series have a little bit of that as well, but it's not nearly as evident because they're more contemporary and closer to "what we know.")

But going back to an earlier post, I will agree that for as much as it's rather dated stylistically, the action animation itself is wonderfully dynamic and still very fun to watch. As much as I love Gundam X, it kind of frustrates me (especially from an AMV creator's viewpoint, as it means I'm picking things apart frame by frame) that the action in that is more muted and not nearly as dynamic as G, Wing or the more recent series.

[InjuredPelican]

Wing is a series I've wrestled with continually. When I first saw it, I was amazed. Awesome mecha, with insanely skilled but often crazy pilots. But as soon as Mobile Suit Gundam aired in America, I felt something completely different. I saw the episode where Ryu sacrificed himself for the crew, and the feelings his comrades had for him. It was so cool that an animated series could have such drama. And that's where the struggle began. For the longest time I could not reconcile the huge differences between Wing and the MSG. I still struggle with it, but eventually i came to see them as separate entities, partially due to me loving both G Gundam and Turn A, both also vastly different from MSG in key areas.

I've always appreciated Wing's MS design, and many of its moments. Relena is an amazing character, as are Trieze and Zechs. But I have such a difficult time relating to the G Boys the way I can with Amuro Ray. But they're still intriguing characters. I even came to see their seemingly insane stunts to be pretty awesome. So I can't relate to it like I can MSG, but I can still find great entertainment from it. I still think there are some problems, but as others pointed out, all of the other series have problems as well. And as someone else pointed out, Wing has so many elements combined to make for a pretty distinct anime and entry into the Gundam franchise.

[LightningCount]

One other thing I like about Wing: The interaction and narrative between Earth and the colonies. It isn't super formulaic in the way a lot of Gundams are, where you come from space, go to Earth, then go back into space. This one has a lot of back and forth, and times where various characters are split on both Earth and space at the same time and are both covered. In fact, the events tend to affect each environment in a give and take. Plus, it should be noted that Wing gets A LOT done in its episodes. The ground covered is remarkable, and each episode sort of feels like 2.5 episodes.

[Mu La Flaga]

Gundam Wing, was my first one.
And over all the series is still good for what it is.

It ended up being popular outside of Japan.
But to me, looking back on Wing it is a tad different from Gundam shows before it kind of.

I can't really add much in here, although to me it was always interesting watching characters with morals or whom kind of voiced their emotions and opinions more strongly.
Like Quatre, Treize, Zechs namely come to mind, Wufei counts also but never was keen on him.
Duo was just awesome for being rather laid back but was also a rather skilled pilot in his own right.

[NastyNate]

I miss how with Gundam Wing you had pilots that where awesome soldiers in and out of their Mobile Suits. Kind of branching off the recent episode of Gundamn with western vs eastern mechs. All too many Gundam shows have kids that are nothing without their mobile suits, but in Wing they can fight with or without them and in a grunt suit. Just look at Hero. He was a beast soldier with hand to hand combat and the ability to sneak on bases and plant explosives. And he was good at hacking with his 90's floppy disc and computer.

[schwarz ritter]

^THIS.

The Leos are among my favorite grunts. They look like actual war machines.

The chicks are also very sexy. Just look at Noin. LOOK. AT. HER. lol

[AmuroNT1]

The 90s-looking technology is what you call "zeerust", a term coined by Douglas Adams and John Lloyd. In short, it means that any depiction of the future will be colored by the perception of what's modern. The classic example (at least to me) is Back to the Future 2's very 80s depiction of 2015. This is an element common to all of Gundam; just look at the original series very 70s bellbottom uniforms, or Judau and his friends' very 80s clothing.

As for the characters doing stuff outside of mecha...yeah, I was recently thinking about an RPG set in the Gundam universe, and how unless you want to fancy it up to resemble Metal Gear Solid or Full Metal Panic, Wing is pretty much the only series where you get action on foot with any kind of regularity. It's understandable from a TV standpoint, but if you're working on an RPG it kind of limits your options.

Also, it's really funny now to hear people talk about how great the girls are (hell, even /m/ has semi-regular "post hot Relena pics" topics), when back when the show started everyone acted like the girls were made of horse manure, nuclear waste, and British cooking.