The Official Gundam Unicorn Anime Thread Mk V

[NastyNate]

My blueray came in on friday, and I will be watching episode 5 this sunday at a Gundam Unicorn Party. I hope to post comments and discussion after that then.

[vipergb34]

The fight scenes in Gundam Unicorn just keep getting better and better every episode.

[NastyNate]

Oh yeah. Episode 4 battles where so good.

[Arbiter GUNDAM]

Besides the fact that it was a giant Zeon fanwank.

[Hi_Nu_Gundam]

Besides the fact that it was a giant Zeon fanwank.

Please name for me a non-Tomino UC Gundam show that HASN'T been a giant Zeon fanwank...

[Arbiter GUNDAM]

Besides the fact that it was a giant Zeon fanwank.

Please name for me a non-Tomino UC Gundam show that HASN'T been a giant Zeon fanwank...

Iknowright?

[Dark Duel]

Besides the fact that it was a giant Zeon fanwank.

Please name for me a non-Tomino UC Gundam show that HASN'T been a giant Zeon fanwank...

08th MS Team, but that's mainly because it was basically less about fan-wanking Zeon and more about trying to do Romeo and Juliet with giant robots(and a happy ending). And this from a guy who LIKED 08th MS Team.

AHEM.

Moving on, I finally received and watched the episode today...and I thought it was pretty kickass. Okay, Riddhe took another level in jackass(with a bonus +10 DERP), but that seems to happen every episode he's in, so I've almost grown to expect it at this point. The entire development between Banagher and Marida went basically as I expected, but the true highlight of that plot point was when Zinnerman came into play. That was really moving.
Banagher and Audrey/Mineva reenacting the rescue from Episode 1 was kind of cool, but even cooler was how Banagher has apparently reached the point where he is able to control the activation of the NT-D and - little detail I noticed that foreshadowed what happened later - when he did activate it, the NT-D Activation Screen changed color from red to green. Of course, the psycoframe glow itself changed to green later on in the episode, but w/e.
Beyond that, pretty much everything involving the Garencieres seemed to be a shout-out to CCA, which I don't much have a problem with in this case because the execution I felt was handled pretty well. Now, Lieutenant Ho Yay ROFLstomping mooks in a purple bot that looks like it belongs in a florist's display window I have a problem with, but that's mostly because I have this thing about hating scenes that involve one guy effortlessly ROFLstomping mooks. Plus I don't like him. I'll concede the scene was brilliantly animated, but I still didn't like it.
I did rather like Not?-Char's few short moments, especially in the last few seconds of the episode. I saw that scene, and immediately six words came to mind: "SAY HELLO TO MY LITTLE FRIEND"

[Deacon Blues]

Besides the fact that it was a giant Zeon fanwank.

Please name for me a non-Tomino UC Gundam show that HASN'T been a giant Zeon fanwank...

The Gravity Front IGLOO OVA?

[Dendrobium Stamen]

The Gravity Front IGLOO OVA?

I'm not so sure... episode 1 is "Federation troops with glorified anti-tank rockets do okay, but are killed off by the last Zaku using clever 'hide-and-seek' tactics; episode 2 was "Federation tanks with a mildly psychopathic veteran in charge do okay, but are killed by Zeons with anti-tank rockets"; and episode 3 was "Federation quasi-MS do better than Federation MS which blithely walk into traps, before also being killed by Zeons".

Now, there was a "death god" motif running through that OVA, but the entire thing could be summed up as "this episode's interesting EFF Chekhov's Gun is still no match for Zeon"...

[Kratos]

I would actually make the argument that the only series that is a Zeon "fanwank" is Igloo (and maybe 0083). They may have their cool moments in others, but are otherwise consistently portrayed quite similar to the Tomino series: bad ideology with a handful of good people involved.

[schwarz ritter]

Besides the fact that it was a giant Zeon fanwank.

I got the same vibe. One of the reasons it was my favorite episode.

[zetatype]

Besides the fact that it was a giant Zeon fanwank.

Please name for me a non-Tomino UC Gundam show that HASN'T been a giant Zeon fanwank...

08th MS Team for sure

0080 War in the Pocket: Despite its focus being on zeon characters, I never felt that this was zeon fanwank material since its portrayal of both sides seemed to be fair.

MS Igloo gravity front: While its doesn't exactly paint the federation in a pretty light I don't see how this could be considered pro-zeon like the previous MS IGLOO entries.

The only ones that come off as fanwank to me are 0083 and MS IGLOO.

Unicorn, for the most part, is neutral to me

[schwarz ritter]

The only real, genuine and honest Zeon fanwank for me has been MS Igloo. Zeon all the way!

[Sume Gai]

The only real, genuine and honest Zeon fanwank for me has been MS Igloo. Zeon all the way!

They all have their moments from where I'm sitting primarily in fight scenes where Zeonic units will pick the federation to shreds way too easily.

08th: the boldest example, In my opinion, is the Apuasalus itself, Zeon basically builds an 'I win' button with a machine that has incredible penetration and striking capabilities. that only really fails because it's designated pilot is in love with the enemy. There's also the whole Norris fight which despite being awesome involves him running circles around 8 federation machines with near absurd ease.

0080: despite being the best OVA of the bunch, in my opinion, the fight scenes were too slanted in Zeon's favor. Four guys taking out a whole base or, worse yet, one guy taking out an entire ship's compliment in almost no time flat. the Final fight I feel worked because we know Bernie had prepared and plan but even then wound up losing his life to accomplish his objective

0083: In this one physics apparently don't apply to Zeon and the Torrington base is way too easy to infiltrate and the nuclear-equipped Gundam way too easy to steal.

MS IgLOO: nearly every single one of these supposedly failed designs proved damn effective in combat, taking out a great share if not all of the forces they wound up against before the tragic glorified demise of the character we were just introduced to.

Beyond all this there is a tendency to romanticize the Zeon fighters as heroically tragic figures and this sometimes gets passed upstairs when it definitely should not be. I must wonder if this has some cultural significance in Japan that is not as apparent to foreign audiences.

[Admiral Larsen]

The only real, genuine and honest Zeon fanwank for me has been MS Igloo. Zeon all the way!

They all have their moments from where I'm sitting primarily in fight scenes where Zeonic units will pick the federation to shreds way too easily.

08th: the boldest example, In my opinion, is the Apuasalus itself, Zeon basically builds an 'I win' button with a machine that has incredible penetration and striking capabilities. that only really fails because it's designated pilot is in love with the enemy. There's also the whole Norris fight which despite being awesome involves him running circles around 8 federation machines with near absurd ease.

0080: despite being the best OVA of the bunch, in my opinion, the fight scenes were too slanted in Zeon's favor. Four guys taking out a whole base or, worse yet, one guy taking out an entire ship's compliment in almost no time flat. the Final fight I feel worked because we know Bernie had prepared and plan but even then wound up losing his life to accomplish his objective

0083: In this one physics apparently don't apply to Zeon and the Torrington base is way too easy to infiltrate and the nuclear-equipped Gundam way too easy to steal.

MS IgLOO: nearly every single one of these supposedly failed designs proved damn effective in combat, taking out a great share if not all of the forces they wound up against before the tragic glorified demise of the character we were just introduced to.

Beyond all this there is a tendency to romanticize the Zeon fighters as heroically tragic figures and this sometimes gets passed upstairs when it definitely should not be. I must wonder if this has some cultural significance in Japan that is not as apparent to foreign audiences.

Perhaps it also relates to Japan's inability to come to terms truly with its dark past in which they did well things that stand in good company with Germany under Hitler during the war.

[Kratos]

The absurdly skilled "enemy ace" is probably more genre convention than specific Zeon fanwank, as are the sympathetic (I think "romanticized" is a bit of a stretch, in most cases) Zeon characters. I don't think this has anything to do with WWII; I don't know how the Japanese fandom feels about Zeon, so maybe there's some psychological thing there, but in the vast majority of the series Zeon as a faction is depicted as antagonistic and "in the wrong" enough that I find accusations of cultural bias on the part of the writers pretty unconvincing.

[Chris]

You guys are going massively off topic. If you want to debate which other OVAs are Zeon fanwanks, take it to another thread, but get back to discussing Unicorn directly here.

[Antares]

I'm exceedingly liking what I'm seeing in Unicorn.
Ep 4 was pretty solid work, aside from the Gundam staples that I usually fast forward over after seeing them the first time. The fighting is getting prettier and prettier, and any show that is willing to give time and space to stock models (OK, custom stock models, but still) to duke it out gets points from me, leaving the Gundams (and massive mobile armors) to their own devices.

The bonding in the desert+cave so Gundam that I actually groaned. The fistfight between Zinnerman (sp?) and Banagher was rather silly, but Gundam, as was the exchange between Loni and Banagher and again I just hoped they could get it over with.

Spoiler

You just knew she was going to die.

Riddhe's character has received an uncustomary amount of work in my opinion. Already in the end of ep 4 I liked him and his slow slide into potential antagonist territory. I think Dark Duel quoted him levelling up in jackassitry in ep 5, but for me his idea of maintaining a system, even a broken one if the alternative is potential anarchy, makes sense as a motivation. He is a conservative in a way, and sees, as quite a few UC/CE/AU characters have astutely noted, the Gundams as overpowered killing machines that throw the world out of whack. Yeah, sure, they are vehicles of change, but if you see that change as worse to the status quo... Besides, getting dinged up by the Banshee and getting jilted were nice bonuses for Riddhe to drawn on to make him an antagonist. I assume he will be one; I have tried not to get spoiled before seeing an ep.

I also credit Dark Duel for the term "ROFLstomping mooks"; hadn't heard that before. I agree though; the appearance of the General Revil was neutered by Full Frontal (he he. he. he he.) and his pretty boy. I just hope ep 6 won't open with not-Char killing them all.

I did rather like Not?-Char's few short moments, especially in the last few seconds of the episode. I saw that scene, and immediately six words came to mind: "SAY HELLO TO MY LITTLE FRIEND"

I saw the scene with the bazooka aimed at the General Revil superimposed with another scene from an earlier Gundam involving Char and a bazooka (aimed at Kycilia), but yeah, generally along the same lines.

On the whole, ep 5 seemed less rehashy of old Gundam tropes compared to ep 4, and that's a good thing, and the plot was nicely shoved further alongside the glorious beam-extravaganza that Unicorn has become. All in all, I am really liking this show and increasingly see it as worthy of Blu-Ray ownership.

[Kratos]

Riddhe's character has received an uncustomary amount of work in my opinion. Already in the end of ep 4 I liked him and his slow slide into potential antagonist territory. I think Dark Duel quoted him levelling up in jackassitry in ep 5, but for me his idea of maintaining a system, even a broken one if the alternative is potential anarchy, makes sense as a motivation. He is a conservative in a way, and sees, as quite a few UC/CE/AU characters have astutely noted, the Gundams as overpowered killing machines that throw the world out of whack. Yeah, sure, they are vehicles of change, but if you see that change as worse to the status quo... Besides, getting dinged up by the Banshee and getting jilted were nice bonuses for Riddhe to drawn on to make him an antagonist. I assume he will be one; I have tried not to get spoiled before seeing an ep.

I think the biggest issue with Riddhe is that everybody's assuming that he becomes a jackass because he gets jilted by Mineva, and only because of that, but here's the thing - I don't think Ronan was entirely correct about his son having "fallen" for her. It's true: if Riddhe and Mineva were a romantic subplot, then it would be a very rushed, half-arsed, and poorly-written one. But it's not really a subplot at all. His character isn't being written from the perspective that most people seem to think it is.

[flamingtroll]

I think the biggest issue with Riddhe is that everybody's assuming that he becomes a jackass because he gets jilted by Mineva, and only because of that, but here's the thing - I don't think Ronan was entirely correct about his son having "fallen" for her. It's true: if Riddhe and Mineva were a romantic subplot, then it would be a very rushed, half-arsed, and poorly-written one. But it's not really a subplot at all. His character isn't being written from the perspective that most people seem to think it is.

I think the bigger issue is that there is no other good reason other than getting jilted by Mineva. None of what is implied by the show as to what the Laplace box was merits that kind of grimdark emo. There wasn't even any substantial relevation on what the Laplace box in the OVA to infer its significants other than the general OH IT COULD DESTROY THE FEDERATION AND START WARS. The whole trip to save Mineva was entirely to save Mineva, not to to maintain the system or whatever.