Gundam-- What IF?

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Gundam-- What IF?

Post by CidHighwind » Wed May 19, 2010 1:58 am

As you may or may not know, Marvel used to run a series titled "What If?" where they had self-contained stories where one or two events in the Marvel history occured a little differently, and how this affects the present times.

You should be familiar with the concept, as applied to Gundam, if you've seen After War Gundam X.

Getting to the point, what do you think would be an interesting "What If" story in any of the Gundam universes? Heres my UC example, yours can be from any universe: What would happen in the Federation's Project Victory, due to lack of Federation mobile suit tech, produced an RX-78 that was underwhelming, little more powerful than a Zaku? Amuro may have survived his encounter with the first two Zakus through sheer luck, but he never would have been able to defend the White Base from Char. Without Gundam data, the GM would never be produced. What would Char use his newfound notoriety among the Zeon for? Would he be able to take over the Zeon and lead the Spacenoids to freedom, or is he doomed without the Gundam's unwitting help?

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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by angelwingzero » Wed May 19, 2010 9:31 am

If you want to check out some "What If?" stories, check out the videos from Gihren's Greed on Youtube; though the game only focuses on the One Year War portion of UC. There are a bunch, and the strangest is the one where Gihren Zabi wins the one years war, and almost everyone who dies during that times survives and lives happily ever after. My What-If would be "What would've happened if Shinn didn't become a puppet in Destiny?"
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by Dark Duel » Wed May 19, 2010 9:36 am

angelwingzero wrote:My What-If would be "What would've happened if Shinn didn't become a puppet in Destiny?"
My personal favorite is actually a minor spinoff on that: "What if Shinn had never gone to the PLANTs?"
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by ShadowCell » Wed May 19, 2010 12:34 pm

I hope this thread doesn't just become a list of alternate scenarios in Gundam.

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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by Volnixshin » Wed May 19, 2010 12:59 pm

You're giving "what if?"'s along the lines of Marvel, but how about a Gundam "What The?"?

Spider-Ham for example
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by ZeroBusterXX » Wed May 19, 2010 7:02 pm

Volnixshin wrote:You're giving "what if?"'s along the lines of Marvel, but how about a Gundam "What The?"?

Spider-Ham for example
Amuro Ray as a stingray? Or Hamuro Ray as a ham.

Would that make him and Beltochika's kid Swiney-Girl?

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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by Volnixshin » Thu May 20, 2010 12:27 pm

What if the Zaku pilots invading side 2(was it 2?) had no depth perception?
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by CidHighwind » Thu May 20, 2010 1:33 pm

ShadowCell wrote:I hope this thread doesn't just become a list of alternate scenarios in Gundam.
This is true. I should have said it more outright, but I hope some people comment on each others ideas and elaborate on them to make this more interesting.

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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by Imperial » Thu May 20, 2010 2:17 pm

CidHighwind wrote:What would happen in the Federation's Project Victory, due to lack of Federation mobile suit tech, produced an RX-78 that was underwhelming, little more powerful than a Zaku? Amuro may have survived his encounter with the first two Zakus through sheer luck, but he never would have been able to defend the White Base from Char. Without Gundam data, the GM would never be produced. What would Char use his newfound notoriety among the Zeon for? Would he be able to take over the Zeon and lead the Spacenoids to freedom, or is he doomed without the Gundam's unwitting help?
I don't think it's accurate to say that no Gundam means no GM. The Federation already had the GM series underway by the time Amuro hopped into the Gundam's pilot seat. The Federation would have fielded mobile suits either way. Of course, the GM certainly would have been watered down without the Gundam's learning computer data. If nothing else, the Feds would likely be able to maintain the stalemate until they can iron out the kinks in their MS technology. By then, Zeon would be wearing thin due to the war of attrition, which never really worked in Zeon's favor in the first place.

Long story short? The war would certainly last longer than one year, but the Federation still pulls it off on numerical might.
My What-If would be "What would've happened if Shinn didn't become a puppet in Destiny?"
I don't really see how that *wouldn't* happen. Even if he didn't buy Rey and Durandal's schtick, he's still a loyal ZAFT soldier doing his job. Sure, we have moments like Rey prodding Shinn toward destroying Athrun's GOUF, but Athrun was a defector armed with a mobile suit. It's Shinn's job to engage him with lethal force. People are quick to peg him a puppet, but what is a soldier supposed to do other than follow orders? It's not as if Durandal or Rey ever gave him any particularly heinous orders, like "kill those civilians." He had little reason to resist them.
My personal favorite is actually a minor spinoff on that: "What if Shinn had never gone to the PLANTs?"
He grows up to be a bitter Orb citizen, possibly backing the Seiran family when they oust Cagalli from power?
What if the Zaku pilots invading side 2(was it 2?) had no depth perception?
Side 7, actually

We would get all sorts of whacky hijinks, probably capped off by Denim and Gene fragging themselves because they misjudge distances.
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by Wingnut » Thu May 20, 2010 6:11 pm

Okay, here's mine. What if South Burning's GM never exploded and he made it back to the Albion with the plans for Operation Stardust?

What would the crew of the Albion do with this info? Would they take it to the highest authority they could find and plead for the EFF to do things differently? I kinda doubt it would have any effect on the outcome at Solomon, but it could end up getting more ships and MS out to stop Cima's colonyjack. Then again, it might not matter at all given how deeply Bask and Co. had their plans in motion and how far their influence reached.

Being in on the plan however might give Synapse the leverage he and Kou would need to get the GP-03 without a fight which would at least save Lucette. Either by convincing that douche to let them take it, or uniting the crew in storming the hanger to steal it. Having Burning still around late might also help Kou better keep his head about his obsession when it came to fighting Gato.
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by Dark Duel » Thu May 20, 2010 11:53 pm

Imperial wrote:He grows up to be a bitter Orb citizen, possibly backing the Seiran family when they oust Cagalli from power?
While I can see how that could happen, I actually personally visualize the consequences of Shinn never leaving Orb going off in a radically different direction, because if there's one thing on Earth he would hate more than the Athhas, it's the Atlantic Federation.
But on the ZAFT side of things, with Shinn in Orb, that would leave someone else(possibly Rey) piloting the Impulse.


Here's another one I find amusing: What if Ribbons Almark, Gundam Meister of 0 Gundam, had not suffered from a massive God Complex, and had simply offed Setsuna and stayed a Gundam Meister himself? Who would replace him as Alejandro's visually-underage boyfriend/master-manipulator(Personally, I like Regene for the role)? And how different would the dynamic and the interactions be between the Meisters, especially Lockon and Tieria? Now there I have no idea. Introducing a second Innovade into the mix, depending on how it's handled, could screw up the whole thing or have really, REALLY interesting results, especially once the TDS comes into play.
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by angelwingzero » Thu May 20, 2010 11:57 pm

Wingnut wrote:Okay, here's mine. What if South Burning's GM never exploded and he made it back to the Albion with the plans for Operation Stardust?

What would the crew of the Albion do with this info? Would they take it to the highest authority they could find and plead for the EFF to do things differently? I kinda doubt it would have any effect on the outcome at Solomon, but it could end up getting more ships and MS out to stop Cima's colonyjack. Then again, it might not matter at all given how deeply Bask and Co. had their plans in motion and how far their influence reached.

Being in on the plan however might give Synapse the leverage he and Kou would need to get the GP-03 without a fight which would at least save Lucette. Either by convincing that douche to let them take it, or uniting the crew in storming the hanger to steal it. Having Burning still around late might also help Kou better keep his head about his obsession when it came to fighting Gato.
The info Burning found may also have explained the deal Cima had with the Feds (probably involving Bask). If the colony drop could've been linked to the Titans (before they became the Feds new army) then the crew of the Albion would definitely not be so happy to wear those Titans jackets.
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by mcred23 » Fri May 21, 2010 10:43 am

Wingnut wrote:What would the crew of the Albion do with this info? Would they take it to the highest authority they could find and plead for the EFF to do things differently? I kinda doubt it would have any effect on the outcome at Solomon, but it could end up getting more ships and MS out to stop Cima's colonyjack. Then again, it might not matter at all given how deeply Bask and Co. had their plans in motion and how far their influence reached.
My guess is that, after getting the information, they'd report it. At the time Burning found that stuff, they didn't know about any of the secret backroom stuff that was really going on (Although those plans may give it away...).

If the plans didn't implicate those various EFF figures, I'd think that they would report it to somebody (Perhaps Wyatt, the big wig on the Birmingham, who was in the area, and involved to some extent). However, eventually Bask or somebody in the plan would find out the Albion learned what was really going on. Given the way Bask is, I wouldn't put it past him to then get the Albion ordered to the Naval Review or something else that would get them all killed and clear up that loose end in their plans.

On the other side, if the plans Burning captured did mention how involved in Stardust members of the Federation really were, I doubt that Synapse and co. would send the report up, for fear along the lines of what I mentioned above. Their problem then becomes what can they do alone, since they may not know how far down the line people are involved (Obviously, the units going to Konpeitoh wouldn't have a clue, but units outside the Naval Review might have been spared because they are loyal/involved with Bask's future plans...).

At that point, though, I have no idea what they would consider doing. Perhaps go rouge and try and stop everything (Sorta like the TSA acted in SEED)? Stay with the Federation and play dumb until they have the chance to act? What choice they would make would lead to dozens other questions (If they choose 'A', then would 'B' happen the same way, and would that change 'C', etc etc), but I think it's safe to say that the last five episodes of 0083 would likely have a rather different feel to them...
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by HalfDemonInuyasha » Fri May 21, 2010 1:56 pm

Another big wild card for 0083 that could provide different "what-if" scenarios would be Axis; what if Axis had chosen NOT to get involved?

Sure, they claimed they were "neutral" when they arrived, but that certainly didn't stop them from giving the Neue Ziel to Gato (or the Z'od-iacok to the New Desides in Sentinal). I could certainly see the Delaz Fleet having a MUCH harder time then since it was the Neue Ziel that was largely responsible for much of the fleet delays and causing the Solar System II to lose its control ship. (That and Delaz's unseen death, which also was most likely NOT supposed to happen as that now gave Gato and the rest of the fleet free reign to attack without anything being held over their heads.)

Also, the GP03, assuming the Albion crew was able to get it, would've been able to rampage through their fleet uncontested (unless another "what-if" scenario were to come into play with Kelly's survival and the Val Varo ending up with the Delaz Fleet.)


EDIT: Also, if they had KEPT the Neue Ziel and the Z'od-iacok for themselves for their own campaigns, that'd also provide different scenarios for Zeta/ZZ or maybe even CCA. Imagine both MA running rampant during CCA along with the Alpha Azieru... x_x;
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by Momaru » Fri May 21, 2010 2:35 pm

Two what-ifs? I've always thought would be interesting are: What if Haman accepted Judau at the end of ZZ and went with him instead of committing suicide? What if Kacyillia hadn't been offed at the end of MSG and managed to escape to axis? The first ones outcome is in my opinion, pretty predictable. Probably Haman would wind up going to Jupiter with Judau, and that'd be it. The second one changes so much though I can't say what might of happened. Probably Zeon would of taken an outwardly neutral stance when they got back to Earth.
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by HalfDemonInuyasha » Fri May 21, 2010 3:16 pm

Well, going with Judau to Jupiter would pretty much be Haman's ONLY option since, if she had stayed, she would've been arrested by the Federation and most likely executed for what she did during Zeta and ZZ as Axis'/Neo Zeon's leader during those times.

In terms of Kycillia surviving, you can bet she'd be the leader of Axis/Neo Zeon instead and Char would be even more pissed off. Though, she'd probably get overthrown by others or at least attempted to like Glemy did with Haman.
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by Dean_the_Young » Sun May 23, 2010 4:31 pm

I wrote two-thirds of a massive fanfic about 'what if there were no Trinity siblings?' in Gundam 00. The Gundams were captured, of course, but it led into a major 3-way war on Eurasia that sparked when the HRL expanded into disputed 'neutral' regions.

It was a pretty big work, come to think of it. Had an invasion of Africa and Japan, Tai-san dying in the collapse of the African tower, Lindt shooting a Shell Flag after being press-ganged into the HRL military, and a big final battle in which Sergei uses a nuclear weapon in a failed attempt to keep the HRL tower from being knocked down, leaving him as a disagraced war criminal and cautionary tale for the ages.

The Union won that war on the basis of 'last tower standing', economically vassaling allied Europe and controlling the rebuilding the African tower, and using total control over all three elevators to put it in charge of the world after a serious insurgency campaign knocked out the predominance of the US in it.
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by Kyuzo Aoi » Mon May 24, 2010 5:03 am

How about what if the Zeons faced an Earth that was disunited in the first place, not even united even in Cosmic Era levels [the Earth Alliance is just an alliance of superstates]?

What if the White Fang had succeeded on their plan or the colony rebels used the original Operation Meteor as planned?

What if the Turn-A Gundam failed to activate the Moonlight Butterfly in its full power in the Black History?

What if the Zeon won the war and the Titans became resistance fighters and Jamitov and Bask are seen as heroes fighting Zeon oppression?

There are many possibilities.
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by TakaTahuNuva » Mon May 24, 2010 7:42 am

I wonder, what would have happened had Puru II not killed Puru on their first encounter? They always have such an interesting relationship in the games, I really think it would have improved the series. ZZ could've become a philosophical drama, exploring concepts such as "who am I?", "am I the original, or just a clone?", etc.
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Re: Gundam-- What IF?

Post by HalfDemonInuyasha » Mon May 24, 2010 1:17 pm

In terms of the Turn A one, it NEVER used its Moonlight Butterfly at full power, nor did the Turn X. From speculative info, the power of the Moonlight Butterfly used on Earth in the Dark History was merely 20% power; 100% would've covered everything from Earth to Jupiter.
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