(What if) A Gundam series with aliens?

[Lans]

How about different perspective? Truth is Gundam is a show (produced by the party that owns the rights) with the official Gundam title in it. Alien or not it will still be a Gundam show. The only diff is your 16 year old hero-boy riding his uber humanoid mecha named something-Gundam and fighting against alien instead of human. OFC, that fans like it or not is entirely different matter. But I will no be surprised if they introduced alien in the franchise. And I think most the fans will still watch it anyway, even if it’s not about humanity or idealism A vs idealism B.

[Gundam Enzyklopadist]

Alien or not it will still be a Gundam show

For me it will not a Gundam show anymore, although the name "Gundam" appears.

A comparison for you: Do you know Godzilla? the Japanese movie series, of course. I am a Kaiju Eiga Otaku, too and I was extremely disappointed by the Emmerich movie - it was not Godzilla.

Same way as with Gundam, do you understand me?

And I think most the fans will still watch it anyway, even if it’s not about humanity or idealism A vs idealism B.

Probably, but it will not a success for Bandai/ Sunrise in my opinion. I would watch it, but I would never be a fan of this kind of Gundam show.

-- Henning

[Lans]

Yes, Henning I understand that point of view completely. I also agree that it doesn't feel like 100% Gundam if the series doesn't have the usual mixture of Gundam-ness materials, like masked-dude-rival, etc etc.

I was simply offering another perspective since nobody seems to think that way.

[TakaTahuNuva]

Just something to note, technically Macross never had aliens until Macross 7. Zentradi and Humans are nearly identical genetically and both have the same ancestors. Ergo, they were not aliens since they were basically the same species, enough so that human laws and human rights were bestowed upon the Zentradi by default. Of course, the Protodeviln of Macross 7 and the Vajra of Macross Frontier are about as alien as it gets. But SDF Macross was not originally about aliens at all.

No, the Zentreadi are still aliens no matter which way you look at it. They are alien to the planet Earth - it doesn't matter if they're humans or not. I mean, at least the Moonrace grew up knowing that they belong to the Earth, but the Zentreadi never even heard of the planet before they started attacking it.

Anyway, I think aliens might work if they handle it like they did in SRW:OG. That way, you'd still have the human vs. human fight (Divine Crusaders).

[Seraphic]

So the Zentradi are illegal aliens? =)

[Dean_the_Young]

Edited to prove a point

No, the Innovadesare still aliens no matter which way you look at it. They are alien to the planet Earth - it doesn't matter if they're humans or not. I mean, at least the Moonrace grew up knowing that they belong to the Earth, but the Innovades never even considered themselves human before they started attacking it.

If Zentradi count as aliens because they didn't come from Earth and are originally/culturally/physiologically separate from it, then the Innovades, who were created not by man but by a computer away from Earth, should also count as Aliens. In which case, Aliens have already come to Gundam.

[Mike87]

If Gundam is about human conflict I don't see why you still can't have aliens. Have the premise of the story be humanity having to face an overwhelming alien threat and the show focuses on the struggle of humanity uniting and overcoming their differences to face a greater threat. Or have humans fight about aliens, like aliens show up, mess up society and now humans are fighting about what the aliens are to them and what to do with them or somesuch. Aliens don't have to be the Big Bad.

[Red Comet90]

Mike you bring up a good point, but I think most people who are on the side of "Aliens in Gundam is a horrible idea" just don't want to see a staple in Gundam change. Its sort of how a lot of people complained and still do about Turn A Gundam's V-fin. Some people out right hate it for being different or think its cool in its own way for changing the norm.

Personally I wouldn't mind aliens as long as the aliens were more of a superficial change rather than a complete overhaul of the themes portrayed in Gundam. In the end it should still be about the effects of war on humans and the earth and not about love triangles and singing songstresses.

[MrMarch]

No, the Zentreadi are still aliens no matter which way you look at it. They are alien to the planet Earth - it doesn't matter if they're humans or not. I mean, at least the Moonrace grew up knowing that they belong to the Earth, but the Zentreadi never even heard of the planet before they started attacking it.

No, the Zentradi are not aliens, especially within context. The OP of this thread clearly stated aliens in a not-human definition. He even specifically excluded the Zentradi, as stated so in his post.

By your definition of alien, any human at least one generation removed from Earth would be considered an alien species, which defeats the whole purpose of this thread as an exercise in supposition, that of introducing aliens into what is a traditionally human-only setting (Gundam).

So the Zentradi are illegal aliens? =)

"Right, right. Somebody said alien, she thought they said illegal alien and signed up"

[ZeroBusterXX]

No, the Zentreadi are still aliens no matter which way you look at it. They are alien to the planet Earth - it doesn't matter if they're humans or not. I mean, at least the Moonrace grew up knowing that they belong to the Earth, but the Zentreadi never even heard of the planet before they started attacking it.

No, the Zentradi are not aliens, especially within context. The OP of this thread clearly stated aliens in a not-human definition. He even specifically excluded the Zentradi, as stated so in his post.

By your definition of alien, any human at least one generation removed from Earth would be considered an alien species, which defeats the whole purpose of this thread as an exercise in supposition, that of introducing aliens into what is a traditionally human-only setting (Gundam).

So the Zentradi are illegal aliens? =)

"Right, right. Somebody said alien, she thought they said illegal alien and signed up"

I tend to think of them as being more like "Stargate" aliens. Humans who are a bit different (kind of an understatement), have a different culture and come from another planet. All things considered, aside from biology, they are pretty alien to most people (myself included).

[Lans]

Well, DNA wise they're close/ pratically similar, so it should be human's alien-relative. Not illegal alien.

[Gadget]

and not about love triangles and singing songstresses. [/color]

What IS WRONG with cute singing songstresses that sells Chinese food?

OK, let's take your suggestion one step up. I like some of your suggestions. In some of the aliens mecha series I've seen, it's mainly about 'them or us'. So not so much of 'Gundam' philosphyising. But what happen if aliens are actually NT capable. Or they have their own version of GN technology. So are we going to see an elite NT group, taking on aliens in their Gundams. Or aliens mecha in Trans-Am mode?
So the story potential is there. There could also be a aliens and humans third group like AEUG or CB.
But one thing I know for sure. In the final show down, there will be a lot of shouting about death and politics between the two aces.

[ShadowCell]

If the story potential rests entirely in the possibility of different mecha fights, then there really...isn't story potential.

[Dendrobium Stamen]

Call it purely personal opinion - largely based on writing a fanfic on a similar premise - but there is a way to make "Gundams vs. Aliens" work, which I think has been mentioned here.

Gundam likes to explore human nature - or try to in some cases - and as such uses the war story as a backdrop for analysing the human condition and what drives humanity to fight. That's not at all incompatible with alien invasion, really. The modern-day archetype for this kind of story would be the first season of the "new" Battlestar Galactica, in which the humans can explore human nature and so forth, while fighting a faceless enemy which seems to have no other objective but the destruction of the human race.

As such, there's nothing stopping the human side delving exploring their own natures and psyches, waxing philosophical on their nature and whether they're truly worthy of survival, while an implacable enemy continues to wear away at their physical and psychological defences with unyielding attacks. So there's plenty of scope for Gundams to wage war, while maintaining a Gundam story at its core - the only difference is that differing views of humanity are confined to a single side of the conflict, which in my opinion could be more interesting than two human forces playing "My views are better than your views" again.

[TakaTahuNuva]

No, the Zentreadi are still aliens no matter which way you look at it. They are alien to the planet Earth - it doesn't matter if they're humans or not. I mean, at least the Moonrace grew up knowing that they belong to the Earth, but the Zentreadi never even heard of the planet before they started attacking it.

No, the Zentradi are not aliens, especially within context. The OP of this thread clearly stated aliens in a not-human definition. He even specifically excluded the Zentradi, as stated so in his post.

No, the OP excluded the idea of Zentreadi from a Gundam series (which is what this thread is about, true), but didn't say they aren't aliens. I'm simply trying to clarify the definitions.

By your definition of alien, any human at least one generation removed from Earth would be considered an alien species, which defeats the whole purpose of this thread as an exercise in supposition, that of introducing aliens into what is a traditionally human-only setting (Gundam).

Let me ask you this - what if Spielberg decided to create a sequel to ET, where it was revealed he was human the whole time. Keep in mind that ET does not look like a human, does not speak any known language, and doesn't really know anything about Earth or "normal" humans. Would you still consider him human?

I'm not saying that "any human at least one generation removed from Earth" is an alien (that's why I mentioned the Moonrace earlier). I'm saying that humans that have been outside of Earth long enough to completely forget their history, and possibly evolved into something that doesn't look like us at all, can't really be considered as human anymore...

[ShadowCell]

If you're talking about characters that have nothing in common with humans and don't even look like humans anymore, then you're just talking about aliens in the traditional sense and you're just playing a semantics game.

The pitfall of trying to divide certain humans up into "aliens" and "humans" should be obvious. Gundam does that all the time anyway in the form of rampaging armies declaring certain people to be "inferior" or "unenlightened." Gihren Zabi did it with Zeon, Ribbons Almark did it with the Innovators.

[MrMarch]

No, the OP excluded the idea of Zentreadi from a Gundam series (which is what this thread is about, true), but didn't say they aren't aliens. I'm simply trying to clarify the definitions.

Let me ask you this - what if Spielberg decided to create a sequel to ET, where it was revealed he was human the whole time. Keep in mind that ET does not look like a human, does not speak any known language, and doesn't really know anything about Earth or "normal" humans. Would you still consider him human?

I'm not saying that "any human at least one generation removed from Earth" is an alien (that's why I mentioned the Moonrace earlier). I'm saying that humans that have been outside of Earth long enough to completely forget their history, and possibly evolved into something that doesn't look like us at all, can't really be considered as human anymore...

I made two separate, distinct points. First, that "I" (and those who agree) say the Zentradi are not aliens. Second, for purposes of this thread (aliens in Gundam), the OP is excluding Zentradi (human-like) creatures and wants not-human aliens. You're not clarifying, you're obfuscating.

The rest of your post is a debate about the definition of a word, the meaning of which needs no debate within the context of the discussion.

[Dark Duel]

Gihren Zabi did it with Zeon, Ribbons Almark did it with the Innovators.

Patrick Zala did it with Coordinators, Muruta Azrael and Djibril did it with Naturals, I'm fairly certain there were elements of the Moonrace that felt the same way towards those living on Earth, etc... The list goes on - And I'm still laughing at "Ribbons"

[ShadowCell]

At any rate, my point is that if you want to introduce aliens into Gundam to give humans something non-human to fight, you don't really need to. We're pretty good at branding each other non-human already.

[Red Comet90]

and not about love triangles and singing songstresses. [/color]

What IS WRONG with cute singing songstresses that sells Chinese food?

Nothing at all. I'm just playing a joke on how Gundam and Macross have been thrown around so much in this topic. I love Macross so I was in no way dissing it.

On the other hand no one's mentioned the Neko girl from Gundam 00F. IIRC she was mechanical and hence thats why she had cat ears or am I wrong? I couldn't believe a neko girl was thrown in the first time I read it.