The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

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False Prophet
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The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

It's not that difficult to look around and find examples of "chicken leg" mecha, by which I mean mecha that have a pair of reverse-joint legs. What is the first example of that kind of design though? The Mars machines from War of the Worlds look more like spider or flying octopi, right?
Mafty
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

I'm not as familiar with pre FG mecha shows: So Probably the All Terrain Scout Transport, which first appear during the Battle of Hoth in The Empire Strikes Back in 1980. It's also an early example of Mechs in a Western work. Has it ever been stated where the idea for the AT AT and "Chicken Walker" came from? You can see Influence of the AT AT design in the Crab and Tequila Gunner from Dougram, plus of the Chicken Walker in the Regult in Macross.
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Arsarcana
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

I... actually can't think of anything earlier than the AT-ST off the top of my head either. I decided to look and see if there was anything written up on the inspiration behind that and couldn't find anything, but a lot was written about the (non reverse-jointed) AT-AT. Here's one example.
False Prophet wrote: Sun Aug 29, 2021 8:00 amThe Mars machines from War of the Worlds look more like spider or flying octopi, right?
Yeah, their legs are described more like flexible tentacles and since they're tripods they wouldn't have reverse-jointed legs even if you gave them recognizable joints.
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MythSearcher
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

While searching for this, I got pointed to this:
https://monster-house.fandom.com/wiki/Baba_Yaga_House

Looking at the previous page on Wikipedia:
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?ti ... =887214913
the examples listed there, Star Wars' AT-ST is the oldest.
False Prophet
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

If Industrial Light & Magic really was responsible for the first chicken leg mecha, then I wonder who exactly designed the AT-ST? I read an interview years ago that IL&M expanded between Episode V and VI, but during the production of RotJ they were still understaffed and overworked.

Also, wasn't there an old black and white movie with a giant chicken? For the love of god I couldn't recall which film was it.
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Seto Kaiba
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

False Prophet wrote: Tue Aug 31, 2021 9:48 pm If Industrial Light & Magic really was responsible for the first chicken leg mecha, then I wonder who exactly designed the AT-ST? I read an interview years ago that IL&M expanded between Episode V and VI, but during the production of RotJ they were still understaffed and overworked.
So, I did some digging and found a brief summation of the origins of the walkers in Episode V in the Star Wars: the Empire Strikes Back 40th Anniversary Special Edition artbook.

According to Dennis Muren, the director of photography for the film, the concept for the Imperial walkers came from some art that Syd Mead drew for a US Steel promotional pamphlet published in 1969. Said pamphlet contained a few paintings showing artists impressions of what steel would be used for in the future, including several sci-fi walkers of different designs including a four-legged "walking truck" that inspired the AT-AT and a piloted cargo handling machine vaguely similar to the one in Aliens albeit larger. George Lucas indicated additional inspiration came from H.G. Wells War of the Worlds Martian tripod walkers.

The concept art was developed by a LucasFilm staff artist named Joe Johnston. The final design was in cooperation with ILM animator Jon Berg, who also built the armatures for filming the studio models.

So I guess the true originator is arguably Syd Mead c.1969, with the development of the Star Wars walker art in January 1979, followed by Japanese artists picking it up in the 80's incl. Sunrise's staff for Dogram and Studio Nue's staff for Genocidas (later Macross).
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MythSearcher
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

Seto Kaiba wrote: Tue Aug 31, 2021 10:25 pm So, I did some digging and found a brief summation of the origins of the walkers in Episode V in the Star Wars: the Empire Strikes Back 40th Anniversary Special Edition artbook.

According to Dennis Muren, the director of photography for the film, the concept for the Imperial walkers came from some art that Syd Mead drew for a US Steel promotional pamphlet published in 1969. Said pamphlet contained a few paintings showing artists impressions of what steel would be used for in the future, including several sci-fi walkers of different designs including a four-legged "walking truck" that inspired the AT-AT and a piloted cargo handling machine vaguely similar to the one in Aliens albeit larger. George Lucas indicated additional inspiration came from H.G. Wells War of the Worlds Martian tripod walkers.

The concept art was developed by a LucasFilm staff artist named Joe Johnston. The final design was in cooperation with ILM animator Jon Berg, who also built the armatures for filming the studio models.

So I guess the true originator is arguably Syd Mead c.1969, with the development of the Star Wars walker art in January 1979, followed by Japanese artists picking it up in the 80's incl. Sunrise's staff for Dogram and Studio Nue's staff for Genocidas (later Macross).
Searched a bit and found that pamphlet on Syd Mead's own site:
https://sydmead.com/category/gallery/us-steel/
More details with ILM quotes:
http://cyberneticzoo.com/walking-machin ... -american/
And a comparison picture here:
http://www.moongadget.com/origins/walkers.html
False Prophet
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

So it is Syd Mead, although he admitted that the US Military already have a prototype walking robot? It's nice to know. I also found the books I came across years ago and saw the first four-legged machine in my life (I only watched Star Wars in junior high): Issac Asimov's Futuredays: A Nineteenth Century Vision of the Year 2000.
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

False Prophet wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 11:25 am So it is Syd Mead, although he admitted that the US Military already have a prototype walking robot? It's nice to know. I also found the books I came across years ago and saw the first four-legged machine in my life (I only watched Star Wars in junior high): Issac Asimov's Futuredays: A Nineteenth Century Vision of the Year 2000.
No, Syd Mead's designs do not have chicken legs, and the inspired AT-AT also isn't chicken legs. The one with chicken legs is AT-ST.
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Arsarcana
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

False Prophet wrote: Tue Aug 31, 2021 9:48 pmAlso, wasn't there an old black and white movie with a giant chicken? For the love of god I couldn't recall which film was it.
The Giant Claw, which is gloriously bad.
Mafty
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

The AT-ST has something of a vague production history. Official sources merely state that someone at ILM invented the "Chicken Walker" for the battle of Hoth and later gave it an expanded role in Return of the Jedi. Lee Seiler later sued claiming that he had invented the Proto Chicken Walker in the late 70s , where it was sold as a design at conventions under the name "Garthian Strider". However Seiler never provided any evidence of the original drawings and the copywrite had only been issued a year after The Empire Strikes Back, so that may not have actually happened.
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Seto Kaiba
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

Mafty wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 1:48 pm The AT-ST has something of a vague production history. Official sources merely state that someone at ILM invented the "Chicken Walker" for the battle of Hoth and later gave it an expanded role in Return of the Jedi. [...]
I literally just quoted from an official source that not only lists the inspiration, but the concept artist AND the model builder...]
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Mafty
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

Sorry I meant the two legged mecha pod(AT-ST), not the the Four Legged one. But Johnson and Berg probably designed and built that one as well.
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Seto Kaiba
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

Mafty wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 3:22 pm Sorry I meant the two legged mecha pod(AT-ST), not the the Four Legged one. But Johnson and Berg probably designed and built that one as well.
They did... we literally have prints of their concept art for it dated 1/28/1979.

I rather prefer their concept version, TBH. It looks more like an AT-AT head cut free and walking around on its own.
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MythSearcher
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

Mafty wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 1:48 pm ...Lee Seiler later sued claiming that he had invented the Proto Chicken Walker in the late 70s , where it was sold as a design at conventions under the name "Garthian Strider". However Seiler never provided any evidence of the original drawings and the copywrite had only been issued a year after The Empire Strikes Back, so that may not have actually happened.
https://strangewars.livejournal.com/4552.html
For whoever wanted details.

BTW, talking about cheap knock offs, Tokyo Marui(Now famous for its airsoft products) published "Armored Walker" and "Walker Gunner" as their second "Original" plastic model, with the first series the famous "Mobile Force"(or more famously known with the first model of that series, "Gungal") and the "yeah I have nothing to do with Gundam" Walker Suit M6's Walker Suit series that came later.
https://lineblog.me/endcape/archives/52498253.html
Both can kinda walk with a winding spring.
False Prophet
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

MythSearcher wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 12:02 pm No, Syd Mead's designs do not have chicken legs, and the inspired AT-AT also isn't chicken legs. The one with chicken legs is AT-ST.
Sorry, my bad.
Arsarcana wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 1:33 pm The Giant Claw, which is gloriously bad.
This maybe it. Thanks!
MythSearcher wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 8:30 pm BTW, talking about cheap knock offs, Tokyo Marui(Now famous for its airsoft products) published "Armored Walker" and "Walker Gunner" as their second "Original" plastic model, with the first series the famous "Mobile Force"(or more famously known with the first model of that series, "Gungal") and the "yeah I have nothing to do with Gundam" Walker Suit M6's Walker Suit series that came later.
https://lineblog.me/endcape/archives/52498253.html
Both can kinda walk with a winding spring.
I've been seeing images of a Gundam-knockoff with drill arm for years and have no idea what is it, other than that it was one of the models originally meant for a generic super robo line of toy before being remodeled into Gundam-knockoffs. Thanks for the name!

(I think there were some other hilarious knockoff mecha models from Japan themselves. Know any?)

While we're on this topic, has Shoji Kawamori ever talked about how did he created the Regult? Also, what is the deal with the ZBP-104 model?
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Re: The first recognizable "chicken leg" mecha

False Prophet wrote: Wed Sep 01, 2021 9:35 pm While we're on this topic, has Shoji Kawamori ever talked about how did he created the Regult? Also, what is the deal with the ZBP-104 model?
Not about the Regult, but the Gerwalk.

Well, if his words is anything to go by, he and Kazutaka Miyatake might have designed the Gerwalk before Star Wars' AT-ST.
https://www.asahi.com/and/article/20190613/2916238/
He got the idea of the reversed legs design after a skiing trip seeing skiers jumping and imagined legs like birds legs.

https://twitter.com/yui1107/status/1160 ... 77/photo/1
This is a project called Genociders by Studio Nue and the machine looking like the Gerwalk is called Test Rover(left) and Gerwalk Aquarius(right)

The project wasn't accepted by the sponsors, and they were shocked to see Star Wars walkers. They even got passed in Japan by Walker Machines in Xabungle.
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