About Char's Zaku II

[Zeong]

I've heard something recently about Char's Zaku II supposedly being 30% faster than a regular Zaku instead of 3 times faster as mentioned in the anime. I'm not sure which one is right. I think I remember somebody mentioning that if Char's Zaku II was 3 times faster than a regular Zaku than it wouldn't last as long in combat than a regular Zaku II or something like that. Could somebody elaborate on this? And about how long would it operate in land and in space?

[Dark Duel]

I've heard both figures.
toysdream(Mark) would know for certain, but IIRC one number referred to its speed and the other to its operating time(how quickly it burned through its propellant.)
Take that with a pinch of salt though, as I can't for the life of me remember where I read that.

[pd771]

Well, I believe it was originally three times faster, which was they said in the show, and is the iconic phrase. I believe it was retconned to 30% faster. And if I remember the little shorts on the 08th MS Team DVDs called "History of the Universal Century", they ironed it out by saying Char was able to use his thrusters and bouncing off of Fed warships during the Battle of Loum in such a way it made him seem three times faster than the other Zakus, thereby being known as a man with a Zaku that was "three times faster".

[Brave Fencer Kirby]

The reconciliation that I recall seeing is that the thrusters of the commander type Zaku II (including Char's custom-painted red one) are 30% more powerful than the standard Zaku II's, and that Char himself tends to move approximately three times faster than the standard Zaku pilot by firing his thrusters longer. This means he has less propellant to maneuver with later in the battle, but he's also harder to hit because he's going faster. This would work particularly well against ships (which is how Char made a name for himself in the first place -- by destroying a whole mess of ships during the Battle of Loum), and remember that the infamous "three times faster" comment was made while he was on an attack run against the White Base.

Perhaps if there had been any experienced officers left on the bridge, they would have cracked some skulls and explained that "faster" in space just means "accelerated longer".

[toysdream]

This is one of those cases where, if we're supposed to take the animation as the ultimate authority, none of the "official" explanations apply. The White Base crew specifically say that Char's Zaku is approaching three times faster than a normal one - not 30% faster - and, since Char had his empty mobile suit launched from his ship and then boarded it in the middle of open space, there's nothing for him to kick against for a speed boost.

On the other hand, given the physics of space flight, a mobile suit could always speed up just by running its thrusters longer. It's purely a matter of how fast the pilot can handle flying, and how much of their limited propellant they're willing to waste. Given the circumstances of the episode in question, this seems like the most plausible explanation to me, but it's still just a pet theory that hasn't been endorsed by any of the official sources.

-- Mark

[Duraham]

can this reasoning also be used to explain his little stunt with the Sazabi, where he is often shown firing the thrusters at full blast while still being connected by the power cord before it is released?



anyway, back to the zaku, it's basically 30% more acceleration, leading to 3x more speed.

[Brave Fencer Kirby]

I'm not entirely sure what the point of the shenanigans with the Sazabi and the cable was. It seems to be something of a "poor man's catapult", designed to give him maximum acceleration before leaving the relatively safe area around the ship, but there's nothing keeping him from just floating free in space and shoving his thrusters from 0% to 100% all at once, which would have the same effect without wasting any propellant.

So the only explanation I can thing of for it is either "it looks cool" (which honestly, it doesn't, particularly) or "Gundam's staff don't quite understand the physics of space travel".

[JEFFPIATT]

The 3x faster line was written before any one thought to write specs for mecha. the profiles written now have to work on paper regardless of what dialog says it is. the short was basically sunrise trying to reconcile the fiction on why operators would say one thing when the facts say different. maybe char was going slower than 30% or someone read the gauge wrong.

[Kuruni]

It was parody in one episode of Keroro Gunso. At one point, Keroro note how powered Giroro is "three times faster than average Keronian" but "it's actually just 1.3 time faster, but he's so fast that you will get fault impression".

[Geoxile]

My personal belief is that Char's maneuvers make him seem 3x faster than regular zakus. Speed =/= maneuverability yet maneuverability can make a huge impression on what appears to be speed. The Mk. II and Gaplant for example, shouldn't be incredibly fast but thanks to their tight turn maneuvers they look like it when they fight midair, it is even commented that the Gaplant used too much fuel pulling fancy maneuvers.

[Calubin_175]

Simply speaking, I think it is 30% faster in terms of technical specs, while it is 3x faster when subjectively perceived in combat. This can also mean that Char can move at a speed in a MS-06S 3x faster than an average pilot can on a MS-06F. Of course, situational circumstances exemplified by kicking off the decks can also contribute to it.

[Gelgoog Jager]

Speaking of MS-06S, this month's MSV-R is about Gaia's Zaku:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v287/ ... S-06Sa.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v287/ ... S-06Sb.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v287/ ... S-06Sc.jpg

The five verniers arrangement seen on the legs of the from Char's MG MS-06S ver 2.0 is used again for this one. The backpack on the other hand looks like a regular F-type's, although there seems to be some sort of option to put a container on top of it.

I'm not sure how the flipped Bazooka is supposed to be used, but I definitely liked the double barrel Zaku bazooka and Zaku machinegun with bayonet. Could these weapons be exclusive for the Black Tri-Stars or MS-06S?

[Geoxile]

The flipped Bazooka, I can think of two hands and centered bazooka or underhand.

[Imperial]

I thought the 3 times/30% problem was explained away as a matter of perception. In reality, the Zaku has 30% additional thrust, which appears to be far more when Char goes zipping around the battlefield, kicking off of battleships and accelerating into turns. Then again, that may have simply been a compromise at which the fan base arrived, rather than any official source.

As pointed out in this very thread, even with the 30% difference, Char could achieve triple the speed of a conventional Zaku by accelerating longer. This would consume fuel at a troubling rate, but that's hardly surprising for a man who favors acrobatic mobile suit maneuvers and has a habit of tempting death with his refusal to wear normal suits in space combat. I could see Char taking that gamble.

[JEFFPIATT]

Well seeing that his plan was to kill off the zabi family while essently helping them with universal domnation. his plan itself was sucide heck he was lucky he wasen't killed after offing garmia.

[Destroy Gundam]

Except he didn't kill Garma. He got Garma killed in a way that could be chalked up to bad luck.

[ZeroBusterXX]

Except he didn't kill Garma. He got Garma killed in a way that could be chalked up to bad luck.

I thought it was chalked up to the misfortune of his birth?

[Dendrobium Stamen]

I thought it was chalked up to the misfortune of his birth?

Char chalked it up to the misfortune of Garma's birth - in other words, being a son of Degwin Zabi, his father's apparent murderer.

Garma's actual death occured in such a way that, at best, Char could be blamed for failing to protect Garma, rather than actively causing him to be killed in action. I'm sure if there was evidence suggesting Char engineered the situation, Dozle would have executed Char with his bare hands...

...Either way, his "three times faster" exploits, if the novel is anything to go by, were part of Char's plot to rise in prestige (and thus power) within the Zeon forces, in order to get closer to Zeon's ruling elite, and thus the Zabis, so he might exact his revenge.

[Geoxile]

Did you guys forget that Char was discharged from Dozle's service as Captain after that? Following his discharge Kycillia took him into her service as a Lt. Commander IIRC

[Dendrobium Stamen]

Did you guys forget that Char was discharged from Dozle's service as Captain after that? Following his discharge Kycillia took him into her service as a Lt. Commander IIRC

It's somewhat off-topic, but yes, and that was largely the point of the off-topic part of my previous post. To recap: Char engineered Garma's death to look like something tried to prevent, but couldn't, leading Dozle to kick him out of the Space Attack Force, rather than execute him for playing an active part in Garma's death. As you note, Kycillia then brings Char into her Mobile Assault Force, with a promotion thrown in for luck (Lieutenant Commander up to Captain, IIRC? It's a two-ranker in the novels).