Dogosse Gier, a tribute to Revil

[Gelgoog Jager]

Gundam Unicorn has decided to introduce a tribute to the late general from the OYW in the form of their most powerful warship by U.C. 0096 (or is it 0097 already?).

General Revil

It is painted in more traditional colors for the Federation Forces, unlike the Dogosse Gier. As you can see, some of the largest guns on the sides were replaced with additional catapults for MS, which probably means that it has even higher MS capacity than it's sister ship.

When it came out I checked on the japanese wiki, (I know it's not the most reliable source of info), but it mentioned that the original Dogosse Gear was most likely the second ship of the Birmingham class, which wasn't completed due to the destruction of the Birmingham itself, which lead to rethink the need of having ships that could carry MS.

This lead to the redesigning of the second Birmingham into the Dogosse Gier class ship we all know.

It also mentions that the Titans wanted to built 4 of these massive warships (they did built 4 Garudas if I'm not mistaken), but they changed their plan with the outbreak of the Gryps War, and only the first one was completed and deployed. I do would have loved to see 4 such warships though.

However, something bugs me: a long time ago I remember reading that Alexandria class ships were removed from duty after the Gryps Conflict since the federation wanted to remove anything that made people recall the Titans (it probably was in a discussion or profile of the Gaunland from V Gundam, from another site, but it made sense). The lack of Alexandria class ships in CCA and F91 does seem to support this idea.

So, while it's good to see the good old General got a tribute of the size he deserved, the fact that they used the design of the flagship of the Titans, which are basically the oposite of Revil, does seem contradicting.

What are everyone's thoughts on this?

Edit: replaced link
Edit 2: changed title

[Mark064]

Not sure if the Japanese Wiki has since changed or what but the info now is slightly different. There is no mention at all about it being the second ship in the Birmingham line at any point, it's only mentioned that it's outward appearance resembles the Birmingham. Another site however mentions the whole other thing. From what the wiki says about the Unicorn novel is that the Titans wanted to build 4 ships, but they didn't have time due to losing the war. The General Revil is supposed to be the new symbol of the Federation army.

If the whole other thing about the Titans symbols with getting rid of them is true or not I don't know. CCA and F91 aren't very good sources of information on these subjects either since we saw very limited scale combats. But from what Unicorn is doing is the opposite of that since the Federation is using the Hizack and the whole Asshimar inspired Ankusha. Not sure if they are still supposed to be using the EWAC Zack and Hizack Custom either...

[flamingtroll]

It doesn't seem very practical to get rid of a well designed ship class just to just for image repair, especially when the Federation seems to have no problem taking Zeon suits for various uses after OYW. Wouldn't a new paint scheme suffice?

[Destroy Gundam]

It could also simply be for money reasons. Large and heavily-armed ships like the Dogosse Gier have to be really expensive, and since major conflicts begin to happen less often past the 2nd Neo Zeon war, I can't see why the Federation would want to spend a ton of money building a massive ship like that when they have plenty of smaller, but still effective, ships in service like the Salamis Kai.

[CYNICISM AT IT'S BEST]

So instead of it being a battleship with the ability to launch suits they redesigned it into an assault carrier type ship, interesting, as for it's design lineage, I've never noticed it before but it does seem to hold water that it came from the same design as the Birmingham, just look at the back end all the way up to about amid-ship, aside from gun emplacements and certain equipment updates they're exactly the same, the engine nacelles even have the same wings.

[Geoxile]

Is that a direct side to side size comparison? Because that thing must be freaking huge to outclass the Ra Calium which was considerably larger than the original Birmingham.

[wonton bob]

I dont think so otherwise the mobile suits comming out of that thing will be huge. It just looks like it's the main focus from the other ships.

[Geoxile]

Yea, I guess. MP psycho gundams aboard that ship? Oh jeez

[Gelgoog Jager]

Not sure if the Japanese Wiki has since changed or what but the info now is slightly different. There is no mention at all about it being the second ship in the Birmingham line at any point, it's only mentioned that it's outward appearance resembles the Birmingham.

My mistake, that part is actually mentioned on the profile of the Birmingham, not the Dogosse Gier.

As for the size of the ship, the only reference we have is that the Birmingham was about 398 meters long. If the Dogosse Gier is indeed the second ship of the Birmingham class after undergoing a drastic change of design, it would mean that it is also about 400 meters long. Despite the modifications, the General Revil seems to be about the same size.

To compare, a Salamis is about 228 meters long and the Alexandria class are somewhere around 340-350 meters long. The Ra Calium is supposed to be 485 meters long, so if the picture did show the right scale, the General Revil would be over 1000 meters long.

Looking at the size of the catapults, when compared to the ones of the Dogosse Gier, they do indeed seem to be meant for taller units, the tallest Federation MS at the time being the Rezel. These MS have a head height of 20.5, but the nose from their MA mode gives them almost a total 30 meters of height.

By the way, it seems that the General Revil could easily have a total of 16 MS catapults, plus the rear one meant for small vessels. However the extra catapults came at the cost of a few of it's largest guns.

And so, while the Birmingham is classified as a battleship, the Dogosse Gier class are considered cruisers, just like the Salamis. On the other hand, the Alexandria class are considered heavy cruisers.

[Mark064]

Well it looks like Gundam Fact File is making the same claim I'm seeing on the Japanese sites about it being the second ship of the Birmingham at one point. But due to the mega failure of the Birmingham and the flawed logic it was totally remodeled, etc. as the Doggos Gier.

It's highly unlikey that the picture is in scale, since the General Revil is the focus it's made larger. We'll have to check on the Zeta Gundam animation to see if there any shots that we can compare the Dogosse Gier too.

I think the illusion of the bigger catapults to hold bigger suits has to do with the line seperating them giving them the illusion they are bigger then they really are. They should be the same size as the Dogosse Giar, it's not like they are going to be lauching an amry of Psyco Gundams or anything like that.

The ship has at least 16 catapults, the new areas themselves added 4.

[Cmdr Harabec]

As I recall, in the Zeta Gundam Viewer's Guide that came with the Boxset, it mentions the Dogosse Giere is approximately 3x the contemporary battleship size, placing it around 1000m. That's been the standard length I've seen it approximated it too, as well, and I'd imagine the General Revil would be quite similiar.

[toysdream]

The model sheets from Zeta Gundam indicate that the Dogosse Giar is twice as long as the Alexandria, and the animation indicates that it's about one third as long as the Jupitris. In both cases, that suggests a length of about 600-700 meters.

-- Mark

[Phantomexe87]

Seems a little odd a Navy inspired force would use the word general. Figure if they had to name her after Revil they would just call it "Revil". Then again, we don't know Revil's first name.

Still, quite cool to see the Dogos Gier make a comeback.

Out of curiosity, how do they dock a ship of this size? Can't see it using the regular space ports.

[saneman]

The Russian navy uses titles in their navy. No reason to assume that Federation would confine itself to the Anglo-Saxon naval tradition.

Besides in the F90 Manga, the flagship in the manga was was named ADMIRAL Tianem.

[Cardi Doorl]

Then again, we don't know Revil's first name.

His full name is Johann Abraham Revil, though I'm not sure it's ever used outside the novels.

[Deacon Blues]

I don't believe his name was ever given in the novels. The first time it was mentioned was in Gundam the Origin I believe. As for the size of the General Revil battleship, the novel states that it's over 600 meters in length with a width of over two hundred something meters. It also states that it's the greatest warship in the history of the Federation Space Forces. It can carry four battalions with a crew of 1500 strong. It has two mobile suit catapults, mobile suit hangers, and something like 4 hull sections (whatever that means). Apparently when the other ship of the line was sunk during the war, a freeze was placed on construction of any more ships.

[Mark064]

Wait only two mobile suit catapults? Then what are the whole bunch of other catapult looking objects, that were catapults on the Doggos Gier.

[toysdream]

The specific passage in the Unicorn novel says that "...two catapult decks which protrude from the front, each made up of four modules that serve as mobile suit hangars, form the bow of the ship." Which is perfectly accurate, I think.

The novel also mentions that the General Revil is the flagship of the Earth Orbital Fleet, that old standby of Gundam 0083 and Gundam Sentinel. As I recall, the Birmingham was the flagship of the Luna II fleet, but I don't think it's ever been mentioned what the Dogosse Gier's official role was.

-- Mark

[Gelgoog Jager]

At first I thought the Dogosse's Gier was the flagship of the Titan's fleet.

However quite often it seemed to operate on it's own, rather than as part of a fleet, so maybe it's more like White Base, something like th ##th Federation/Titan's Autonomous Corps.

[scythedd7]

As I recall, in the Zeta Gundam Viewer's Guide that came with the Boxset, it mentions the Dogosse Giere is approximately 3x the contemporary battleship size, placing it around 1000m. That's been the standard length I've seen it approximated it too, as well, and I'd imagine the General Revil would be quite similiar.

FYI, it says and I quote:

This immense battleship, twice the size of cruisers like the Argama and Alexandria, ...

myself assuming you're talking about the US one written by Mark.

I don't think it's ever been mentioned what the Dogosse Gier's official role was.

To be pure awesome, duh! And it seems to run around on its own only when Scirocco was its captain, and he didn't seem to follow to many orders anyway. Once they took it away and Bask was in charge, it is shown operating in a fleet and seems to be serving as a flag/command ship. I mean how could it not? It's huge compaired to the other ships around it and it has Captain Bask on board, who was essentially the commander of the Titans fleet at that point