The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by sdwoodchuck » Wed Mar 08, 2017 2:34 am

You keep reframing what I'm saying into something I haven't said, and then responding to that.

Clearly I don't expect Rustal to remain the primary villain. He's bland, he's uninteresting, and he doesn't make for a satisfying antagonist. So if he's all there is to it, that is the curveball for me, because I expect better than that from the writing based on what we've had so far. McGillis becoming the primary villain would not be the curveball as far as I'm concerned; it's the foregone conclusion.

Tekkadan made the choice to ally with McGillis, while being pushed into it via his manipulations. And nobody is saying that Rustal's faction isn't completely despicable; again, that doesn't even enter the conversation I'm having.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Amion » Wed Mar 08, 2017 11:47 am

I think Rustal is proving more and more interesting from my standpoint. Originally I thought of him as a bland, uninteresting mustache twirler. And he is still a mustache twirler. He's also proving to be one magnificent bastard, outsmarting his enemies at every turn.

In a lot of ways, my personal belief is that Rustal Elion is meant to come across as bland and uninteresting. He is meant to be an undynamic, impenetrable wall, upon which corruption and stagnation and the preservation and continued accumulation of personal and Gjallarnhorn power are supported. This makes us empathize with our heroes, even the still-beguiling McGillis, who feels more and more Durandelish with each episode his disconcerting "All is in hand" smile remains plastered on his face. They're so close to really changing the world, possibly for the better, if people like Kudelia step up to fill the power gap, and the Tekkadan were close to gaining Mars itself for their very own!

And then they just can't muscle through the Brick Wall the Arianhrod Fleet represents. Rustal is too firmly established, and McGillis' 0 Gundam impression attempt failed to move the hearts of Gjallarhorn, leaving no other real option but to do so, at least in the short term. It's quite painful to see, really, and it is no wonder Orga feels terrible. So close, yet so, so far... right back to square one, really. His family have been dealt a Go to Jail card, and they were almost at Go.
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Zeonista » Fri Mar 10, 2017 4:47 pm

Damn, this was not the final fight, and it was intense! I guess McGillis & Orga have one more chance to win at Mars, but it will definitely be more difficult than before. It is a heartbreaker but exhilerating & a little triumphant at the same time. Sort of like watching Zeta Gundam for the first time again, albeit this time being emotionally prepared for the gotterdammerung to come. :) Kudos to IBO for the extended big finish, as well as the oft-criticized character development episodes for making us give a damn about the carnival of carnage.

Mighty Mousie: Julieta saved the day for Rustal-sama, but promptly paid for it by having her MS beaten into wreckage by Barbatos. I wonder if she will remain confident about her ability to attain victory as a non-modded human?
Give it 100%: Mika-kun against Julieta, and finally taking off the gloves. That will teach him to hold back! Wow, talk about a broken Aesop...
Blaze of Glory II: Mikazuki is not gonna make it to the end. He is going to go 100% and burn himself out in order to put the bad 'uns away.
Atrea has a different look about her: But Mika-kun will carry on in the future to come... ;)
Nowhere to run, nowhere to hide: Tekkadan right now, they have to conquer or die.
Former Brigadier General: Shouldn't be surprised McGillis, you knew the wimps wouldn't back you if you lost. Gotta win or die with what you have on hand.
Tragedy of Misunderstanding: Gaileo versus McGillis. I am not sure if Gaileo could have ever understood the goal & intentions of McGIllis though.
The Indispensible Man: I wonder if McGillis has seen himself this way since he joined Gjallarhorn, joining his private and public ambitions together. If so, he had best be careful now; the graveyards are full of the moldering bones of men who thought themselves indispensible to the situation at hand. It is very possible that he may have the victory, yet he himself not enjoy its fruits.
Blandly Evil: That would be Rustal, no? But that is the thing, we don't need a Sith Lord here, just a bastard wielding power for power's sake. Rustal Elion is the face of the smug elite privilege that props its jackboots atop Mars from the green paradise of Earth. He is The System made flesh, and as long as he and his ilk rule Earth and Gjallarhorn, the world as depicted in Season 1 will not change. In that respect he is a very classic Japanese villain, all the way back to Ashikaga Takauji, if not earlier.
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by yazi88 » Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:31 am

Damn... today's ep shows how ruthless and heartless Rustal really is... he is really bloodthirtsy and is willing to go all out to destroy anyone who stands against him... He can't be left in charge of Gjarrhorn, I can't see it happening at the end of the show...

McGillis will find a way to turn things around I'm sure, If McGillis is killed along with Rustal and his 2 cronies Iok and Gaileo, I can be satisfied with that. Maybe have Gjarrhorn dissolve as a organziation and have something else replace it by the Earth Government blocs. After seeing how Gaileo doesn't care or raise issues with Rustal's ruthlessness, I don't see any redemption for his character unless he decides to betray Rustal at the last moment... Either that or he is killed in combat by either McGillis or Mika. Yeah revenge is his goal, but he can offer nothing as a possible future leader of Gjarrhorn or as a decent guy...

McGillis is cunning and scheming, but he is nowhere near as evil or heartless as Rustal is... Or Iznario for that matter... the Seven Stars can't be trusted to keep Gjarrhorn in check anymore... Sure McGillis's uprising drove Rustal to be defiant and take over the organization, but given what we saw in season 1 with Gjharrhorn, it was going to be like that anyways.... Its a corrupt organization that answers to no one and is willing to commit plenty of war crimes.

Yes, McGillis can possibly turn in a dictator with his quest for power, but there is also a possibility he can burn the current Gjarrhorn into the ground and rebuilt the organization into a more decent group that does not have unlimited power and can play a active role into reshaping the world. He needs power to do that and yes while he had to resort to underhanded methods to do it, he has far far less blood on his hands aside from soldiers dying under his command when he lead them into battle. In some ways I see McGillis being a bit like Reinhard from LOGH, wanting power to take over the empire and rebuilding it into a decent organization from the decaying and corrupt organization it was.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by ASW-G-01 » Sun Mar 12, 2017 8:11 am

I think he is not like Reinhard at all but i think Rustal is like Oberstein.Unlike McGillis,Reinhard had an eye for talent (maybe because of kirchies)and he did not make more enemies than he needed.Reinhard is a leader that McGillis cant even dream of becoming,he learn to trust.Even though Oberstein use ruthless method and tactis,he say that at some point he cant even debate with him because the method is so effective.
On the other hand McGillis choose those who is like him in upbringing and discard all noble like Gaelio from joining his crusade.It is like saying all rich guys are BAD,the other group like his upbringing is good.For me that is his greatest undoing,cant believe in somebody and live in Agnika fantasy.We should have ask him to read LOGH.(kidding)That is just me though.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by phillosmaster » Sun Mar 12, 2017 11:36 am

What an F-ed up episode. Tekkadan's only glimmer of hope was to run away and erase their identities. Then at the end it looks like they can't even achieve that.

Again Mcgillis just kind of looks on and smiles. Is he delusional at this point or does he have some sort of plan. I'm not sure I have enough confidence in Mcgillis at this point to think he's doing anything other than just winging it. Like the Gjallarhorn officer said he's been pretty lucky up until this point. I guess we'll see. I really wonder where the show is going with him because he appears to have lost everything as well.

I really like the interactions between the second string characters in this episode like Zack, Hush and Dane. It did a good job in showing a human side to Zack and Dane especially who have mostly just been background color so far. It seems like the season two recruits are meant to be a sort of outside perspective to the more indoctrinated original Tekkadan guys like Ride, Eugene and Akihiro.

Also I loved Mika asking Kudelia for help raising his child. I wonder if Mika feels regret even though he talks in such finite terms. I think Kudelia is suppose to be some sort of foil for Mika to show him what life could be without war. It was the scene where he started to read about farming again that made me doubt he is so ready to just throw his life away for Orga and Tekkadan like he usually asserts. I mean this is sort of an inflection moment a bit for Mika now that him starting a family with Atra is out there as fact. I got the feeling in these scenes that he's started to think about the future again like he was in the beginning of the season.
Even as we speak, the stealth bombers of the Brotherhood of Dada are swooping silently overhead. They’re using stealth bombs which level whole cities without even the slightest trace of noise or damage. Nothing remains of the world you knew and still you stand in the ruins, acting as if nothing has changed.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Amion » Sun Mar 12, 2017 11:47 am

The only valid comparisons I see with Reinhard and McGilis is that both wanted to topple their respective governments/organizations and had blonde hair. In no way is Reinhard's personality parallel to Macky's, the opposite if anything. If not for Oberstein, he might have had no real skeletons in his closet, and even then the massacre of the noble's planet saved many, many more lives in the long run. And even in that Reinhard was tricked by Oberstein, mostly because it was, sadly, the correct decision based on saving lives. But instead of callously taking the offering for what it was, Reinhard tormented himself over it and even let it spin into the reason for Kirkies' and other admirals' deaths.

And then there's the sheer intellect. Reinhard von Lonhengram was a master military strategist, if nothing else, something McGillis Fareed demonstrated to in no way be, not with ships warfare at least. I can hear the Kaiser laughing all the way back from Valhalla even now at the idea.

Oddly, McGillis favors Lohengram's sister more, being the sexually abused one, though her response to it wasn't McGillis' way of thinking.

And now, defending mein Kaiser's honor complete for now... this episode of Gundam Tekketsu no Orphans.

Wow. So this was an emotionally powerful episode, and all the more so because it puts us back where the series began: a desperate flight to Earth and Grandpa Makanai. It could have gone so differently that the frustration discharges from the air. But alas for spilled blood, crying over it goes the same way as milk.

The System Made Flesh truly is... now Rustal is in McGillis "rightful" position, and intends to lead Gjallarhorn from now on with the iron fist of so many Elitist Earth Governments and Politicians before him. Congratulations, Rusty, you now receive stamps of approval from faceless and nameless Earth Federation officials, Oz aristocrats, Jamitov of the Titans, and several other nebulous political giants. We tried to collect a Zabi signature on your War Crimes diploma, but they were not impressed with your little spears or colony rebellion antics. Try gas next time before playing in the big villain leagues.

We noticed your eyebrows, and assumed you were related to Treize, but he shredded his signature in our face, so we assume you two are not on and never will be on speaking terms. You haven't the noble ambition, Elion.

As for McGillis, doesn't he have Montag? Surely there's something he can pull there. Perhaps we WILL be seeing Hitlerstache Todo one last time. So far he's not collected any badges. He outright failed the Scirocco award, and Char sends his displeasure with these words of revolutionary wisdom: "Try assassination next time! Don't you know dead men never fulfill grudges from the grave?" Words to work by, Macky. Oh wait! You DID get the Surugu Stamp of Approval, demonstrating your incompetence and failure to internally change the system from within. Of course, that likewise gives you the Cold Stare Badge from Lelouch vi Britannia. Tisk, tisk, Macky!

Now, as for our heroe*cough* I mean, villainous Tekkadan boys, the feels were real this episode. The moments with Atra and Mika were sweet, but maybe they should make, ahem, extra sure they're going to have a baby. Then again, is this a sign of Genre Savvy? With them unsure, Mika's chances of survival increase significantly!

And Orga, Orga, your nobility toward your family is real, but alas that won't save you from the System Made Flesh. Good thing Kudelia is there to help you, otherwise you would all be doomed. Thank you for your emotional performance. You may die now in your white coffin. *gestures at the stage* The curtain rises for the last time... who will survive?
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by X_zoro » Sun Mar 12, 2017 1:45 pm

Hush really should have punched Zack, he sounds like that little bitch Saji, why did Mika top him ?!! also looks like we our heading towards the bad end.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by phillosmaster » Sun Mar 12, 2017 1:50 pm

Well to be fair we have every indication that Tekkadan is marching toward their deaths. It's not unreasonable to want to flee, but for many of the Tekkadan boys they feel like there is no where for them to go and/or they don't want to abandon their Tekkadan family. Zack appears to have a life outside of this with his father, so that goes a long way to explain why he's not been totally on board all season.
Even as we speak, the stealth bombers of the Brotherhood of Dada are swooping silently overhead. They’re using stealth bombs which level whole cities without even the slightest trace of noise or damage. Nothing remains of the world you knew and still you stand in the ruins, acting as if nothing has changed.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by X_zoro » Sun Mar 12, 2017 2:11 pm

phillosmaster wrote:
Sun Mar 12, 2017 1:50 pm
Well to be fair we have every indication that Tekkadan is marching toward their deaths. It's not unreasonable to want to flee, but for many of the Tekkadan boys they feel like there is no where for them to go and/or they don't want to abandon their Tekkadan family. Zack appears to have a life outside of this with his father, so that goes a long way to explain why he's not been totally on board all season.
Then he has more of a reason not to criticise Tekkadan members like Hush and Dane who have nothing, Dane was a killer and Hush saw his friend kill himself, Akihiro was taken away from his family by space pirates and became human debris, Biscuit not only lost his parents but lost his brother too , Arta lived in a whore house and Mika and Orga killed people as kids, 90% of Tekkadan's members are war orphans, only 6% have family, Orga has made it very clear that Tekkadan isn't just an organization, its a place for boys who have no where to go, if he had a home why did he even join in the first place lol ?

https://ih1.redbubble.net/image.2185476 ... ,070,f.jpg it really just blows my mind, like Zack were you hoping to bang hot chicks in Tekkadan ? lol

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by SNT1 » Sun Mar 12, 2017 2:32 pm

I actually disliked a good amount of this character episode, because of... characters.

-That boring threesome/harem proposal by Atra. Took a good 5 minutes for crap I don't care about. Congrats to Mika though, the first Gundam lead to make a baby someone. Since they're being so 'edgy' with their characters they might even kill Mika off and have Atra and Kudelia start a gay relationship with Atra's baby. whee.

-Speaking of which, Kudelia is still useless, just when I thought she can offer a sizeable amount of (financial) help on this episode.

-Zack's boring whining. Get out. You've whined 36 times through his tenure at Tekkadan, and it seems like you still have a legit, living family. So get out already!

-Orga's moping. Orga has done this about 292 times already, and it goes like this: Orga mopes about Tekkadan, crew comes in and "knocks some sense" into him, and he borderline cries and says arigatou. Everyone continues to follow into the spiral of hell

-Flashes of Hush being in this early self, being this otherwise normal guy with actual goals to become a great pilot. In reality, still Mika's walking stick

-McGillis still in scheming mode. Unless he knows something that we still do not (i.e. Bael being a beastmaster of MA's or something, I'm speculating), stop with the scheming face, You only look like an idiot. In any case, unless Bael has some tide-changing wildcard system as speculated, don't expect McGillis to betray Tekkadan. I've called it; it's the other way around and Tekkadan betrays him first.

+One good thing to come out of this... is this, boring, uninspiring character called Rustal Elion. This is one, ruthless magnificent bastard. Really, he's just cutting off and outmaneuvering these little ants at every turn, and has even united Gjallahorn and the Seven Stars on his side. Unlike Iok, who's so annoying that we want him to die in some of the worst ways, I actually admire this boring, uninteresting character right now. Maybe he's still boring and uninteresting, and most everyone else is just even moreso...

+Is it Iok vs McGillis next episode? Will McGillis finally actually kill a Seven Star?

+Accountants saved Tekkadan!

I'm probably in the very small minority with this, but for the most part I think IBO does well when mobile suits are bashing each other in the guts and falters very quickly when they showcase their big, mostly underdeveloped characters (while other Gundam series still remain good when it's a non-combat episode).

That said, I can't wait to see what the last 3 episodes entail, or if we will see the greatest asspull in all of Gundam to resolve this in Tekkadan's favor.
(>-.-)>-} >>---> \(x.x)/

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by yazi88 » Sun Mar 12, 2017 2:39 pm

This episode shows that even if Tekkadan didn't ally themselves with McGillis, Rustal would still wipe them out. They were a thorn to his side since the Dort Colony incident in season 1, and the Edmonton conflict was a major embarrassment to the organization. He was out for Tekkadan's blood even before McGillis officially joined forces with them.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Amion » Sun Mar 12, 2017 3:23 pm

yazi88 wrote:
Sun Mar 12, 2017 2:39 pm
This episode shows that even if Tekkadan didn't ally themselves with McGillis, Rustal would still wipe them out. They were a thorn to his side since the Dort Colony incident in season 1, and the Edmonton conflict was a major embarrassment to the organization. He was out for Tekkadan's blood even before McGillis officially joined forces with them.
I completely agree. He would have ended them back in S1 weren't not for Kudelia-hime getting in the way. This time there are no disgustingly honest reporters. There are no witnesses but some old woman on her farm. Tekkadan will be trampled and buried in the plot of dirt that sprang them.
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by X_zoro » Sun Mar 12, 2017 4:10 pm

^ Also given Rustal's words to Orga, Takaki is most likely dead ( men in black might have killed him on earth)

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by domino » Sun Mar 12, 2017 4:39 pm

Despite the numerous deathflags raised, I suspect that this won't end on Mars. McGillis' smile was very knowing - as if he expected Rustal to want to wipe them out swiftly.

It's very likely that McGillis went to reactivate whatever was left of the mobile armour and/or its sub-units. That will give Tekkadan and McGillis the room to escape

This means we may end up with a space battle finale during which Rustal meets his end. I doubt that Mika or much of the rest of Tekkadan will survive though.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Amion » Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:45 pm

I'm just waiting for McGillis to extend his hands and say "rise, Angelic Hosts. The True Gjallarhorn has use for you once again".

Truth be told, I doubt this will happen. It would be a glorious and horrific twist, because of the level of deception it would represent. Perhaps it's something more down to earth. McGillis did have Orga meet with all the reps of the Earth Blocs. Could be they are ready to get behind him and overthrow Gjallarhorn's corrupted element: and who better to target first than the Corruption's favorite poster boy?
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by AmuroNT1 » Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:47 pm

I've got a sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach that this is all going to end tragically...

Anyhow, I don't blame Zack for being a voice of reason. He's basically doing what Merribit did in the first season, and if you'll remember a few episodes ago Yukinojo encouraged him to keep speaking up and not just going along with everyone else. It looks like he stuck around after his conversation with Dane, though.

Kudelia's reactions to everything this week were a small bright spot in the creeping darkness that approaches.

Iok...might actually have matured. If that was the plan all along, for him to act like an idiot early on then grow up after things kept going wrong, he'd basically be this show's Colasour.

As for McGillis, I don't think he's crazy or anything like that. He just realizes that there is literally no ending for him other than victory or death. He can't sweet-talk his way out of this one if he loses; Rustal's going to put his head on a pike like this was "Game of Thrones". And so with nowhere else to go, he keeps pushing forward - just like Tekkadan.

Also, I'm confused, did McGillis lose ALL his people in that last battle, or did they abandon him after he was stripped of his position? Because from this episode it looks like he's the only non-Tekkadan person left on this side.
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by Amion » Sun Mar 12, 2017 7:29 pm

Somehow I think the Mars Branch director allowed McGillis' men to go free while he went into hiding with Tekkadan, sort of like what Orga wanted from Rustal and was denied, only in McGillis' case he had the favor to call in, apparently. That's what I assume. He does leave his ship (what is that class called again?) to board the Isaribi, so clearly his men aren't with him anymore.
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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by sdwoodchuck » Sun Mar 12, 2017 9:52 pm

Still looks to be setting up the paradigm shift I hypothesized. McGillis has some wildcard up his sleeve; it's going to outright destroy Rustal and his fleet, and then it/he is going to be a threat to Mars, making McGillis the final big-bad that he's obviously been since the tail-end of Season 1, and paving the way to a final MS duel that the franchise likes so much.

Rustal's entire character is just "I'm going to do the most evil thing at every turn." It's 100% bland. You guys are nuts if you think he's the final villain of this series.

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Re: The Official Gundam Iron-Blooded Orphans Anime Thread Mk III

Post by yazi88 » Sun Mar 12, 2017 10:07 pm

Rather than Rustal being bland and being evil, his goal is to keep order through massive sheer force, he is very smart and quite cool headed. Rustal is keeping Gjarrhorn at top power by suppressing everyone by force, you could say its one way why there haven't been massive conflicts since the Calamity War which is very surprising given other Gundam shows that wars occur every couple of years yet in IBO there hasn't been a war for 300 years. Gjarrhorn went from being a force that stops conflicts into a facist organization.

I can kind of see why Rustal wants Gjarrhorn to stay in complete power, but the organization is rotting from the inside and the seven stars are corrupt themselves.

What Rustal is doing is not so different from Scirrico or other villians from Gundam... we don't need to hear villian's evil plans all the time. I'm basing this off his actions and from the times he speaks. Rustal knows how to play the long game, which is something I don't see very often in other Gundam shows...

Maybe McGillis might be the final villian at the end depending on his actions or maybe McGillis will perish, but Rustal has been the main villian for majority of the 2nd season. Its pretty clear to see given the conflicts he has caused and his actions.

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