heat sabers in space?+beam saber question

[ORegan]

why didn't Zeon(after the construction of the Gouf, and after Zeon was pushed back into space) equip their Zaku's with Heat sabers to combat the GM's more efficiently in close quarters? even considering the fact that close quarters fighting wasn't as common(unless it happens to be a hero/villain fight) wouldn't have been worth it for that added boost?

and also, what happens if a newtype manages to hit a beam shot with the beam from its saber? would it do a light saber move and be deflected or just dissipate?

[Hyakushiki]

Perhaps because they began developing beam weaponry which they saw it was more effective, hence the Gelgoog's beam naginata.

As for your second question, a beam saber would behave like a beam shield and dissipate the energy.

EDIT: fixed.

[Zeonic Glory]

^Minor nitpick, but, the 'Goog has a beam naginata.

[ORegan]

Perhaps because they began developing beam weaponry which they saw it was more effective, hence the Gelgoog's beam naginata.

but before they had the gelgoogs, the heatsaber would have been the next best thing. they could have at least replaced it for the rick doms heat pole

[mcred23]

why didn't Zeon(after the construction of the Gouf, and after Zeon was pushed back into space) equip their Zaku's with Heat sabers to combat the GM's more efficiently in close quarters? even considering the fact that close quarters fighting wasn't as common(unless it happens to be a hero/villain fight) wouldn't have been worth it for that added boost?

There's an assortment of reasons why it wasn't used. For one thing, Zeon already had huge numbers of heat hawks around and in active use (It was used by both the Zaku I and II, so it had been in production for quite a long time) and was decently effective. While it wasn't as good as a heat saber or a beam saber, it still worked.

Second, the basic MS-06F can't easily carry a heat saber, it would require a Dom-like modification (Which may have been easy to do, but thats beside the point), so they can't typically go into battle with them, unless they hand carried them (Which defeats the point of the heat weapons being a back-up). Going back to the first thing, the heat hawks were still around in huge numbers and still fairly effective, so they were far easier to issue out to Zaku units.

but before they had the gelgoogs, the heatsaber would have been the next best thing. they could have at least replaced it for the rick doms heat pole

You've got your terms mixed up there. The heat saber is the Dom/Rick Dom weapon, while the heat sword was used by the MS-07 Gouf series. It wasn't used mainly because it's larger size probably made it harder to mount as a secondary weapon (Gouf's usually hand carried them) and because the Gouf (The machine it was intended for) had a fairly short production...

[HalfDemonInuyasha]

Yep...the only recorded time I can find that a Zaku had even a Gouf's heat sword was the MS-05S Zaku I Commander Type owned by Gerhart Schmeisser of the Midnight Fenrir and even then, the Zaku I had had some minor modifications made to it which were easy to do since the Gouf is on a similar frame to the Zaku.

I can't recall any other time when a melee weapon was used by something else like that except from Test Types or Prototypes of those units.

[razgriz]

would a quick beam saber strike cut through the heat hawk/saber/sword blade or at least weaken it for the next cut?

[ORegan]

i think a heat weapon can block a beam saber, but after long exposure, heat weapons get over heated and turn into pre-heated metal,making them easier to cut through. if i', wrong someone correct me on that

[Red XIV]

At least once, Char (briefly) parried Amuro's beam saber with a heat hawk.

The explanation for that would presumably be that a heat hawk blade, by its nature, would need to have a higher melting point than regular MS armor materials. Thus, it would take the plasma contained in the beam saber a little bit longer to melt through.

My guess is that Char's Zaku would be needing a new heat hawk after that battle regardless, though.

[razgriz]

so what maybe 5 or 7 solid hits against the heat blade in order to cut through it? obviously the guy wielding the blade would no better and try to run before tempting fate

[ORegan]

i think it would depend on how frequent you hit the heat weapon. if it has time to cool down, then it'd be ready for another shot. if not, then i'd say 3 or 4 quick slashes in succession, but im not a chemist, so don't take my word for it. but I do feel slightly moronic for saying "give the HEAT weapon time to COOL."

[mcred23]

Maybe. However, we do see cases of beam and heat weapons going at it like crazy (Episode 6 of 0080 being a good example) without the heat weapon breaking. I think it's just something that would happen in very long, drawn out fights (And most melee battles are short and quick).

[razgriz]

probably best tactic then would be for the beam saber equipped suit to go sith and go for chopping the hand off the heat weapon equipped suit then

[mcred23]

Not really, as such an idea could easily go both ways (Either pilot could try and chop the other's weapon hand off). The best idea is to simply go for the cockpit and kill the enemy (Since you are usually trying to kill them and they're trying to kill you).

[razgriz]

just pray your not fighting against shinn in the impulse then

[mcred23]

Well, given that this thread has been about heat weapons and Zeon (And thus, UC), I would assume such a thing would never happen.

[razgriz]

oh ok just pray your not fighting against kou piloting the gp-01fb and having stolen a heat hawk from a zaku he just downed

[Toxicity]

The blade of a UC beam saber is contained within an I-Field, isn't it? So if you were to shoot one with a beam rifle, the shot would be deflected.

As for the heat sword/Zakus in space thing, all the Zeons would've had to do to make it easier for the Zakus to carry Gouf swords is to give them Gouf Shields.

[L]

The Zakus had heat hawks...and they intend to use it. I agree with that. As said before re-outfitting a MS weaponry for combat when they're already deployed is not very effective. I think the heat swords are not that much into effect in battles since then as battles tend to use long-ranged weaponry more. I'd say the heat saber and sword are both better weapons than a heat hawk in terms of reach and all, but I don't think the Zeon would want to do complicated things like replacing weapons.

By the next stage of the battle, Rick Doms are sent to space from re-outfitted Doms, making the heat saber its main arsenal in short-ranged combat. And then, they began developing Gyan and the Gelgoog. From the history of their MS development, I think that outfitting space-use heat saber and swords on any unit back then wouldn't be their main interest, especially if they intended to field and mass-produce beam weapon using MS like Gelgoog.

As for the heat sword/Zakus in space thing, all the Zeons would've had to do to make it easier for the Zakus to carry Gouf swords is to give them Gouf Shields.

That would even get them more complicated. Using shields might make those Bazooka carrying Zaku having difficulties in using weaponry, say the Zaku's bazooka. IIRC the Gouf had the ranged weapon mounted on arms. And if they did decide to use heat swords, what will happen to the no-longer-used Heat Hawks?

[Cardi Doorl]

The blade of a UC beam saber is contained within an I-Field, isn't it? So if you were to shoot one with a beam rifle, the shot would be deflected.

What makes you say that? I-fields are never seen to deflect beam shots. All they do is dissipate them. I don't there are any UC examples of a beam shot hitting a beam saber blade, but I imagine that so long as the beam shot isn't far more powerful than the beam blade, the shot will be dissipated (though the beam blade would, I presume, be temporarily interrupted).

* * *

What L said about the impracticality of even bothering to re-equip the Zakus is very much true. Zeon had tons and tons of Zakus in service already, so going through all the trouble of outfitting them all with new secondary weapons would require time and resources that they, at that point in the war, can't really afford to detract from Gelgoog development/production and Rick Dom production.