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 Post Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 12:24 am 
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Mecha Flunky
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Does anyone have anything like.. the dimensions, weapons and complement statistics for the ( Neo Zeon/axis )Gwadan-class battleships from Zeta gundam/a new translation? Cause theres like no information anywhere that I can find on it and it's beginning to irk me quite a bit. xD I'd really like to know coz I guess I'm a lil' too curious so please and thank you. It's actually these questions that brought me here to this website in the first place. XP

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 Post Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:09 am 
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Mahq's profile on the Gwadan covers the weapons:

Armament: 2-barrel main gun x 2, 2-barrel secondary gun x 10, secondary gun x 4

Specs not included in the profile would be:

Propulsion: rocket engine x 21 (of various sizes).
Launch catapult: 4, including one on each side of the ship, one behind the upper main gun and a large one at the bottom of the ship that can supposedly rotate to launch MS in different directions.
Other features: large external propellant tank x 8, large Komusai x 2 (located right below each of the two side catapults. I have the cosmo fleet figure and they defintely look like the old style Komusais, upside down), throne room (image on Mahq's profile).

Regarding it's length, this is what Mark said in this thread:

toysdream wrote:
Speaking of Axis ships, and scaling based on shared features:

http://www.ultimatemark.com/gundam/images/gwadan640.jpg

Here, I've scaled the Gwadan so that its external fuel tanks are the same size as those of the original Gwazine. This makes the Gwadan about 640 meters long, which seems fairly plausible, but the catapult decks and launcher turret seem too small for its mobile suits. Its gun turrets also look quite puny compared to those of the Gwazine. On the other hand, if we scale it up by 50 percent, it's just ridiculous:

http://www.ultimatemark.com/gundam/images/gwadan960.jpg

As a compromise option, here's the Gwadan scaled up by 25 percent (in other words, so that its fuel tanks are 25 percent large than those of the Gwazine). This seems like a reasonable compromise; we can now imagine mobile suits fitting in its catapults, and it's somewhat larger than the Dogosse Gier, as the animation suggests:

http://www.ultimatemark.com/gundam/images/gwadan800.jpg

In this scenario, the Gwadan would be about 800 meters long. That's still pretty humongous, and it makes the Gwazine and Gwanban look dwarfish by comparison.

-- Mark


However in this pic that Mark posted in this thread, the Gwadan seems to be twice as long as the Dogosse Gier. If the original Dogosse Gier is as long as the second ship of the class, the General Revil, it would be 600 meters long. In the picture the Gwadan seems to be almost twice as long, which would give it a lenght of 1,200 meters.

As for its MS capacity, although it's generally presumed that it can carry over a 100 MS, in this other thread, Mark points out that a common figure in videogames is 60 MS. I will point out that during the Gryps War Axis MS are mainly Gaza types, out of which 1 out of every 6 is a Gaza E while the rest are Gaza C.

Finally, in Zeta we can confirm the existance of 3 such ships, out of which the namesake of the class is destroyed during the Gryps War. The fate of the other two is unknown, although in Sentinel Gundam another Gwadan class, the Gwaley, briefly appears in the story.


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 Post Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:29 am 
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Mecha Flunky
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Thank you very much. xD

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 Post Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:29 pm 
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I didn't know the Gwadan had Komusais, nor did I knew they even made Komusais that big.


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 Post Posted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 6:57 am 
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Yeh, I had absolutely no idea they even bothered with komusai's for anything but musai class or musai-descendant class type warships.

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 Post Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:33 am 
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Does the Gwadan have AA-AM guns for the defence against mobile suits?


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 Post Posted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 2:01 pm 
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I ended up revising those size estimates a little bit. In Gundam UC, we see a silhouette of the General Revil overlaid over the Dogosse Giar, which indicates that the latter is smaller - specifically, if the General Revil is 630 meters, then the Dogosse Giar would be about 505 meters. This surprising conclusion is largely borne out when you place them side by side in scale. See here:

http://www.ultimatemark.com/gundam/images/ucships_comparison.jpg

Since the Gwadan seems to be about twice the length of the Dogosse Giar, that means it's about 1000 meters long.

-- Mark


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 Post Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 3:35 am 
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toysdream wrote:
I ended up revising those size estimates a little bit. In Gundam UC, we see a silhouette of the General Revil overlaid over the Dogosse Giar, which indicates that the latter is smaller - specifically, if the General Revil is 630 meters, then the Dogosse Giar would be about 505 meters. This surprising conclusion is largely borne out when you place them side by side in scale. See here:

http://www.ultimatemark.com/gundam/images/ucships_comparison.jpg

Since the Gwadan seems to be about twice the length of the Dogosse Giar, that means it's about 1000 meters long.

-- Mark


This seems to be the best compromised size.
Cannons are big enough to look like comparative with other ships of the same age, Catapults are big enough to let MSs through, Bridge seems to be small enough so you don't have to shout in order to be heard...

How exactly did it get sunk is a mystery though, something that big usually are quite durable.(at least you have more parts to blow up before it is not usable.


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 Post Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 12:43 pm 
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MythSearcher wrote:
How exactly did it get sunk is a mystery though, something that big usually are quite durable.(at least you have more parts to blow up before it is not usable.
As has been shown many times in various animations, internal explosions and detonations of ammo/fuel and so forth can be comparably far more devastating than the output of the weapon that caused them.
So in the case of the Gwadan, someone could have slipped a shot or two in a key area that caused an explosive chain which sunk the vessel.

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 Post Posted: Tue Sep 01, 2015 1:59 pm 
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IIRC, the Gwaden is sunk in a similar way as the Gwadan, after Cima shots a fuel depot in the MS hangar right before leaving. I would assume that the easiest way to sink a Gwadan would be by destroying the external propellant tanks, assuming these are full or almost fully loaded at the time. Still, if the wrecked Gwazine from Zeta or the Dolos ship seen at the end of the 0081 OVA are anything to go by, even after being "sunk" these ships might be capable of remaining in one piece and even partially operational.

After watching the Unicorn's version of the Nahel Argama's Hyper Mega Particle Cannon which uses the bottom of the central catapult to form some sort of barrel using what I assume are several I-field generators, I couldn't help but wonder what a similar weapon mounted on a Gwadan's lower catapult would be capable of. Not to mention that this catapult is supposed to be able to rotate 270 degrees fore. Perhaps it would be able to pull a zig zag shot like the one that Solar Ray is supposedly capable of in the Gundam novels.


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 Post Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 11:14 am 
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Gelgoog Jager wrote:
I would assume that the easiest way to sink a Gwadan would be by destroying the external propellant tanks, assuming these are full or almost fully loaded at the time.

That's unlikely. Unlike fuel for internal combustion engines, jet engines, or chemical rockets, propellant for nuclear thermal rockets usually isn't explosive in and of itself. (There are some exceptions -- like atomic hydrogen, which is reactive enough that it tends to explode even when it's just sitting there -- but they're usually not used as propellant for precisely this reason.) So destroying the external propellant tanks probably wouldn't cause much more damage than lowering their propellant reserves.

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 Post Posted: Fri Sep 04, 2015 12:38 pm 
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Well, Gundam series like to depict these as highly explosive:

-In Gundam Seed Destiny, the Girty Lu ejects its external propellant tanks and then proceeds to detonate them in an attempt to sink the Minerva.

-An example in UC, though not a warship, is the Sinanju which ejects its propellant tanks right as its about to be hit by a beam magnum shot. The explosion from these is big enough for Banager to think that he shot down the whole MS.

-And let's not forget MS Igloo, whose love for making anything explode upon being touched would make anyone wonder if atomic hydrogen replaced of helium-3 in the OVAs.

I do agree with you on the fact that it depends on the type of propellant used. For example, the Tieren's propellant tanks are filled with water, which is another non-explosive type of propellant.


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